Author Topic: Liverpool Brick wall - Mary Ellis  (Read 782 times)

Offline gemmanoon

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Re: Liverpool Brick wall - Mary Ellis
« Reply #27 on: Tuesday 09 April 19 01:44 BST (UK) »
Ooh I will take a look later. Thanks!

It's an interesting sighed comparison to see the variations on conditions that my Liverpool ancestors lived in, and so frustrating how much working class social history is lost. I found some lovely maps and a few contemporary sources, but i wish more was available and there was more money/time/resources to help archive all this fabulous stuff. With 160 years of history in the city on both sides of my tree, it is sometimes surprising to see how little there is.

Anyway back to the Ellis family:

I can't find a marriage for Sarah and Robert. I suspect they get together in Liverpool between 1881 and 1886 as her eldest son is born in Liverpool, as is Mary. However this won't be the first "married" couple in my tree that weren't legally hitched, so we will see if I can uncover anything.

 I did find two possible births for Thomas Francis, so I plan to cross reference the mother's name with  the three possible Mary Ellis births I have. It occurs to me that Sarah may needed have married, so birth records might be the way to go.

Of course this isn't going to help me prove I have the right Mary, but at least it will be very thorough even if ultimately wrong! If anything me he an idea of how I can tie or disprove Mary's parent one way or the other, I would appreciate the tip!

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Offline Ruskie

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Re: Liverpool Brick wall - Mary Ellis
« Reply #28 on: Tuesday 09 April 19 05:32 BST (UK) »
There is (or was) quite a lot about Liverpool living conditions, social history etc on the internet. A lot of the links I had to excellent sites are broken unfortunately.

Ged Fagan's In A City Living - Yo Liverpool is a "go to" site though it has changed since I looked at it ages ago, so I don't know my way around it. It used to be full of wonderful images but I'm not sure if they are still there:
http://www.yoliverpool.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?168-Ged-Fagan-s-In-A-City-Living

I will see if I can find any live links and post any I find. :)

Added: Some good photos here (though I prefer the b/w ones):
http://streetsofliverpool.co.uk/page/6/

https://www.liverpoolpicturebook.com/p/l4-l5.html

Added: I think there are links on Ged Fagan's site too (which I have not investigated).


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Offline Ruskie

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Offline gemmanoon

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Re: Liverpool Brick wall - Mary Ellis
« Reply #30 on: Tuesday 09 April 19 06:09 BST (UK) »
Thanks Ruskie - my Dad is going through Liverpool Picture Book and we found a photo of the house he grew up in - long gone now, and the only photo we have of it, so that was really special! The Liverpool Maps have been invaluable, and I'm saving up so I can get a copy of the 1848 one shipped out to Canada.

Liverpool is definitely luckier than most places (I'm looking at YOU, Hull,) in terms of what's available online, I guess it's just I want specific streets and that's rather unreasonable... especially when I want them from 1850 or earlier  ;D  In fairness though, it doesn't look like there is any trace of some of the places my family comes from thanks to the Blitz, but I'm lucky that my dad used to patrol some of the areas back when he was a copper, so I've got access to a ready-made street directory.

I did also come across Ed Farrell's paintings of historical Liverpool and I'm desperately hoping that he makes them available to purchase soon in print form. Have you checked them out? His reconstruction of the Workhouse is particularly well done, as is the picture of the area between Marybone and Scotland Road in the early 1800s (other side of my tree from this lot).

Considering how much time I spent in Liverpool in my youth, and how much it's changed in the last twenty years, I shouldn't be surprised how different it was for each generation. Anyway, now I'm off to mourn the loss of Quiggins, and start mapping all the pubs that my parents and I have drank at over the years :-D

Offline Ruskie

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Re: Liverpool Brick wall - Mary Ellis
« Reply #31 on: Tuesday 09 April 19 06:52 BST (UK) »
Anything that the Blitz didn't take out clearances over the years probably did. Now there have been clearances of clearances of clearances I believe ....   :( Last time I was in L'pool I saw some nice little terraces, easily renovate-able which were marked for demolition. Shame to lose all those characterful houses (and other buildings) that can be done up. :'(

I will have a little look at Ed Farrell's work.  :)

Added: ooh yes, very interesting work - a lot of detail. you should him send a message asking about prints.  ;)

Offline Tall Al

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Re: Liverpool Brick wall - Mary Ellis
« Reply #32 on: Tuesday 09 April 19 07:50 BST (UK) »
Hi
Regarding the Toxteth Park burial in 1888 for Robert Ellis found by Ruskin - this is not our man - he was a master mariner and was the husband of Eliza Jane Ellis.

Alan

Offline Ruskie

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Re: Liverpool Brick wall - Mary Ellis
« Reply #33 on: Tuesday 09 April 19 09:17 BST (UK) »
Hi
Regarding the Toxteth Park burial in 1888 for Robert Ellis found by Ruskin - this is not our man - he was a master mariner and was the husband of Eliza Jane Ellis.

Alan

That is a shame, but good to eliminate him anyway. Can I ask where you found the information. I was hoping it would be him as he lived in the area. His age varied through the censuses, so probably best to broaden the search.  :)

Offline Tall Al

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Re: Liverpool Brick wall - Mary Ellis
« Reply #34 on: Tuesday 09 April 19 09:42 BST (UK) »
Hi Ruskie,

Yes - found it on Toxteth Park Cemetery Inscriptions (a site produced by Robert and Rose Anderson).

Just been trying to find possible deaths for Robert and Sarah - working from the 1881 census showing their ages a 54 and 55. Guesswork really without certificates, but a death for Sarah Ellis in Toxteth Park registration district in 1885 age 60 and possibly Robert Ellis in Liverpool registration district in 1890 age 64.

Nearest I can currently see, but as you say their ages vary greatly so it is a bit of a problem finding the right one..

Alan

Offline Ruskie

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Re: Liverpool Brick wall - Mary Ellis
« Reply #35 on: Tuesday 09 April 19 10:10 BST (UK) »
Thanks Alan. Lets just hope that Robert and Sarah are the right parents.  ;)