Author Topic: Liverpool Brick wall - Mary Ellis  (Read 772 times)

Online rosie99

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 29,947
    • View Profile
Re: Liverpool Brick wall - Mary Ellis
« Reply #9 on: Monday 08 April 19 08:43 BST (UK) »
There are no Rs or Hs on the rest of the certificate, although it also looks remarkably like the B in Banns, hence my husband's helpful suggestion of bobest.

There is an R in Road.  It is very similar to the probably written more quickly first letter in Robert
Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

RootsChat is the busiest, largest free family history forum site in the country. It is completely free to use. Register now.
Also register instantly with Facebook or Twitter (and other social networks). Start your genealogy search now.


Offline wivenhoe

  • RootsChat Aristocrat
  • ******
  • Posts: 2,865
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Liverpool Brick wall - Mary Ellis
« Reply #10 on: Monday 08 April 19 08:55 BST (UK) »
Census 1881  at 11 Barclay Street Toxteth Park Lancashire
EMMETT John           27yrs      ship wright 
EMMETT Mary          20yrs      wife
EMMETT Florence       1yr        dau           all born Liverpool


Census 1891 at 14 Haylock Street Toxteth Park Lancashire
EMMETT   Mary          30yrs
EMMETT   Florence     11yrs     scholar
EMMETT   John             9yrs
EMMETT   William         7yrs
EMMET     Herbert        5yrs
EMMETT   Walter          3yrs
EMMETT   Isabelle        2yrs             all born Liverpool Lancashire

Census 1901   at  26 Hodges Mount Toxteth Park Lancashire
EMMETT   John            42yr
EMMETT  Mary             40yr
EMMETT  Florence       21yr
EMMETT  John            19yr        apprentice shipwright
EMMETT  William A      17yr       ships steward
EMMETT  Herbert        15yr        ships steward
EMMETT  Walter          14yr        grocers errand boy
EMMETT  Bella            12yr
EMMETT  Lillie               4yr                   all born Liverpool Lancashire

In 1911 John, wife Mary and daughters Isabella and Lillie are at 8 Barclay Street.

RootsChat is the busiest, largest free family history forum site in the country. It is completely free to use. Register now.
Also register instantly with Facebook or Twitter (and other social networks). Start your genealogy search now.


Offline ShaunJ

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 16,431
    • View Profile
Re: Liverpool Brick wall - Mary Ellis
« Reply #11 on: Monday 08 April 19 09:03 BST (UK) »
A couple of Roberts from elsewhere in the same marriage register
UK Census info. Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline Tall Al

  • RootsChat Veteran
  • *****
  • Posts: 615
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Liverpool Brick wall - Mary Ellis
« Reply #12 on: Monday 08 April 19 09:27 BST (UK) »
Hi,

In looking for Goring Street, in the 1881 census if you look for a William Peet born 1854 Toxteth -   there is a Rootschat posting for this family - you will see that family in Goring Street. - Toxteth Park District 38.

In 1871 the Robert and Sarah Ellis (and Mary) mentioned earlier were in the same district number - it is extremely difficult to read but looks like a part of Upper Mann Street. Interestingly Robert's occupation is shown as Labourer - the same as on Mary's wedding certificate.

Alan

Offline Ruskie

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 22,807
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Liverpool Brick wall - Mary Ellis
« Reply #13 on: Monday 08 April 19 12:35 BST (UK) »
Hi,

In looking for Goring Street, in the 1881 census if you look for a William Peet born 1854 Toxteth -   there is a Rootschat posting for this family - you will see that family in Goring Street. - Toxteth Park District 38.

In 1871 the Robert and Sarah Ellis (and Mary) mentioned earlier were in the same district number - it is extremely difficult to read but looks like a part of Upper Mann Street. Interestingly Robert's occupation is shown as Labourer - the same as on Mary's wedding certificate.

Alan

It is odd that the places of birth for the family on the 1871 census are different from the 1861. Robert born in Ireland rather than Wales, and Sarah born in Shropshire rather than Liverpool. "Wife's son" is Thomas Francis and Mary is aged 13. Ages are a bit out for all of them.  :-\ At first glance it seems like the same family .....  :-\

Offline Tall Al

  • RootsChat Veteran
  • *****
  • Posts: 615
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Liverpool Brick wall - Mary Ellis
« Reply #14 on: Monday 08 April 19 13:57 BST (UK) »
Hi,

Unsure of the country as you point out - 1861 it says Robert from Gurley, Wales; 1871 says from Cargurly, Ireland! Can't see any such places  but for me the fact that his wife is shown in 1861 as being from Ellesmere, Shropshire and 1871 Shropshire is relevant.

The other thing that suggests it is the same family is the presence of Thomas Francis who appears to be Sarah's child from a previous relationship. 

Alan

Offline Ruskie

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 22,807
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Liverpool Brick wall - Mary Ellis
« Reply #15 on: Monday 08 April 19 14:16 BST (UK) »
Hi,

Unsure of the country as you point out - 1861 it says Robert from Gurley, Wales; 1871 says from Cargurly, Ireland! Can't see any such places  but for me the fact that his wife is shown in 1861 as being from Ellesmere, Shropshire and 1871 Shropshire is relevant.

The other thing that suggests it is the same family is the presence of Thomas Francis who appears to be Sarah's child from a previous relationship. 

Alan

Although it does not specify "Ellesmere Shropshire" on the 1861 census, it fits with the 1871 giving her pob as Shropshire. I was thinking she was born in Ellesmere Port which is closer to Liverpool but I think you are right.


Offline gemmanoon

  • RootsChat Extra
  • **
  • Posts: 58
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Liverpool Brick wall - Mary Ellis
« Reply #16 on: Monday 08 April 19 14:23 BST (UK) »
Wow this was all amazing to wake up to! Thank you, and it just shows that fresh eyes make a whole world of difference.

I am going to sheet out my kids and get them to school, then come back to this on a few hours.  Thank you all so much, hopefully I can make some progress with Robert and Sarah to see if I can confirm a relationship to my Mary Ellis.

I might have to wait until later census are released to see if Mary changes her age, but it's the best lead I have had in a a while. Thank you !

Offline Ruskie

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 22,807
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Liverpool Brick wall - Mary Ellis
« Reply #17 on: Monday 08 April 19 14:38 BST (UK) »
There are a lot of Robert Ellis and Sarah marriages in a possible time frame. If this is the right family and Sarah came from Shropshire they may have married there, so the net would need to be widened further.

I was not going to bother mentioning the following as I had nothing to offer as proof, but if you look at that particular Robert and Sarah in the 1861 census there seem to be three families living at the same address which looks like 50 Skirving Street (?).

One of these is a John and Ellen Rowland. I don't know if it is relevant but I found a marriage in 1853 in Ruthin  :-\ for a Robert Ellis and a Sarah Rowlands. I have no idea if this is the 1861 and 1871 Robert and Sarah nor do I know if they are your Ellis family, but I thought I would throw it in anyway. Likely to be a red herring ....  :)