Author Topic: Murder, Mystery and My Family  (Read 1325 times)

Offline ThrelfallYorky

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Re: Murder, Mystery and My Family
« Reply #9 on: Tuesday 09 April 19 13:30 BST (UK) »
River Tyne Lass:- surely someone ought to make a television programme about this?
Threlfall (Southport), Isherwood (lancs & Canada), Newbould + Topliss(Derby), Keating & Cummins (Ireland + lancs), Fisher, Strong& Casson (all Cumberland) & Downie & Bowie, Linlithgow area Scotland . Also interested in Leigh& Burrows,(Lancashire) Griffiths (Shropshire & lancs), Leaver (Lancs/Yorks) & Anderson(Cumberland and very elusive)

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Offline River Tyne Lass

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Re: Murder, Mystery and My Family
« Reply #10 on: Tuesday 09 April 19 13:54 BST (UK) »
I agree.  I would love to see a TV programme about this.  It would be good to try to solve who really did murder Dorothy using modern day barristers and advancements in detection.  I wouldn't like to be on TV myself though so if they could make it without me it would be great. ;D

It was written about in numerous newspapers at the time and I even read in one report after the trial that all the jurors believed that they were actually guilty.  However, I think that they may have had prejudice against my ancestors.  I think they were spoken about in derogatory terms at times - perhaps because they were poor travellers.

I am amazed that one of my ancestors' lodgers who was also on trial - the Mother of Michael Allen (Tibby Anderson)- was permitted to go back to the cottage and hug and pray over the corpse before being carted off to prison to await trial.  Although, I suppose as there was no DNA investigations they probably would not have considered this contaminating a crime scene.

If this was just a story and not something that really happened I believe there would have been two other people potentially in the frame.  These two were not even considered but I think they should have been as I can see a motive for both.  Both might be innocent but because of their high up position for one/relationship for the other these were not even considered for a nanosecond.  However, if this murder took place today and I was one of my ancestors I would be asking for these other two also to be investigated.  It is probably a bit shocking that I am considering another two and I may be wrong.  However, I do not think that only my ancestors and their lodgers should have been in the dock.

Conroy, Fitzpatrick, Watson, Miller, Davis/Davies, Brown, Senior, Dodds, Grieveson, Gamesby, Simpson, Rose, Gilboy, Malloy, Dalton, Young, Saint, Anderson, Allen, McKetterick, McCabe, Drummond, Parkinson, Armstrong, McCarroll, Innes, Marshall, Atkinson, Glendinning, Fenwick, Bonner

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Offline Viktoria

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Re: Murder, Mystery and My Family
« Reply #11 on: Tuesday 09 April 19 17:09 BST (UK) »
At the moment the programme that looked at old cases is being re run.
Today was about a young illiterate woman with five children who was convicted of poisoning her husband with arsenic but her friendís  evidence was very suspect not least because she was questioned at  length in private with no written record of what was said,,,.
Family were going to have another go at solving this ,would like to hear how it went for them.
Viktoria.

Offline 3sillydogs

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Re: Murder, Mystery and My Family
« Reply #12 on: Wednesday 10 April 19 10:45 BST (UK) »

Sounds like an interesting case RTL.  Would definitely make an interesting programme, so many different suspects.....


Certainly makes you think Viktoria.  The sudden drop in hormones after birth must definitely have an effect on the body and women not all being the same are affected in different ways until they all stabilise again.
Paylet, Pallatt, Morris (Russia, UK) Burke, Hillery, Page, Rumsey, Stevens, Tyne/Thynne(UK)  Landman, van Rooyen, Tyne, Stevens, Rumsey, Visagie, Nell (South Africa)

Offline Lisajb

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Re: Murder, Mystery and My Family
« Reply #13 on: Wednesday 10 April 19 13:54 BST (UK) »
Not on the same scale, and not a murder, but one of my ancestors was transported for nicking a tree from the Duke of Beaufort's pleasure gardens.

He'd previously pinched some oats.
Mullingar, Westmeath Ireland: Gilligan/Wall/Meagher/Maher/Gray/O'Hara
Bristol: Woodman/James/Derrick
Bristol/Somerset: Saunders/Wilmot
Gloucestershire:Woodman/Mathews/Tandy/Stinchcombe/Marten/Thompson
Wiltshire: Mathews
Carmarthen: Thomas, Davies, Lewis, Humphreys, Williams, Jenkins

Offline 3sillydogs

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Re: Murder, Mystery and My Family
« Reply #14 on: Thursday 11 April 19 10:06 BST (UK) »
Not on the same scale, and not a murder, but one of my ancestors was transported for nicking a tree from the Duke of Beaufort's pleasure gardens.

He'd previously pinched some oats.

so a repeat offender ;D ;D ;D 

Crazy what folk were transported for back then.  But pinching a tree?  A useful one like a fruit tree I hope? ;D
Paylet, Pallatt, Morris (Russia, UK) Burke, Hillery, Page, Rumsey, Stevens, Tyne/Thynne(UK)  Landman, van Rooyen, Tyne, Stevens, Rumsey, Visagie, Nell (South Africa)

Offline Lisajb

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Re: Murder, Mystery and My Family
« Reply #15 on: Thursday 11 April 19 12:01 BST (UK) »
Not on the same scale, and not a murder, but one of my ancestors was transported for nicking a tree from the Duke of Beaufort's pleasure gardens.

He'd previously pinched some oats.

so a repeat offender ;D ;D ;D 

Crazy what folk were transported for back then.  But pinching a tree?  A useful one like a fruit tree I hope? ;D

I hope so, at least he could have fed his family, along with the oats. But I'm afraid I have visions of it being something merely decorative. I suppose he could have used it for firewood, to cook porridge made from his ill gotten oats!
Mullingar, Westmeath Ireland: Gilligan/Wall/Meagher/Maher/Gray/O'Hara
Bristol: Woodman/James/Derrick
Bristol/Somerset: Saunders/Wilmot
Gloucestershire:Woodman/Mathews/Tandy/Stinchcombe/Marten/Thompson
Wiltshire: Mathews
Carmarthen: Thomas, Davies, Lewis, Humphreys, Williams, Jenkins

Offline Vance Mead

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Re: Murder, Mystery and My Family
« Reply #16 on: Thursday 11 April 19 12:08 BST (UK) »
I have a murder mystery in my family, my great grandmother in 1928. It was determined that she committed suicide but tried to make it look like murder.

https://www.newspapers.com/clip/716327/cora_mead_thornewill_photo/
Mead - Herts, Bucks, Essex
Pontifex - Bucks
Goldhurst - London, Middx, Herts
Kellogg/Kelhog - Essex, Cambs

Offline radstockjeff

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Re: Murder, Mystery and My Family
« Reply #17 on: Thursday 11 April 19 12:15 BST (UK) »
George Shellard was my ggrandfather's brother-in-law. Born in the Wiltshire village of Grittleton (near Castle Combe) in 1852. He was employed variously as a servant,groom and coachman and went to live and work in Bridgwater where he married in 1872.

For whatever reason the family moved to Ashton in Makerfield by 1880 where he was employed as a groom and was noted as being a horse breaker.
     
He met Ellen Whittle  and formed an association with her and by 1893 she had been thrown out of her matrimonial home and was living in Gresford near Wrexham.

Although she wished to end her association with George, he persisted.
Matters took a turn for the worse when he tried to visit her and she is reported to have said "If you are not off I shall call the officer and have you put off the premises."

With that turn of events he returned a couple of days later and on a pretext got into the house, shot Ellen twice and then cut her throat with a razor. He then shot himself and died of his injuries.

Not a pleasant tale! and one which has only recently surfaced within the family.
Nurse, Musther, Smith, Julnes, Rogers, Parsons,Grieves(Greaves,Greeves),Wood,Cray,Scrine,Shellard,Greenstock,

There's nothing wrong with being mediocre...as long as you're good at it!