Author Topic: Vernon Industrial School information help  (Read 804 times)

Offline Kylie B

  • RootsChat Veteran
  • *****
  • Posts: 785
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Vernon Industrial School information help
« Reply #18 on: Wednesday 15 May 19 12:12 BST (UK) »
Hi JM
I am really confused now...the death certificate makes no mention of an inquest. It states George died on 17th June and was buried on 19th June.
I have re-checked the inquest papers and they are definately for the same man- died on 17th June 1893.

So there cannot have been a funeral notice for him in May, although perhaps that funeral notice is for the man who died in Toowoomba hospital of a stomach bleed? But that means there should be 2 deaths in QLD for a George Creighton....

So confused  ??? ??? ???

RootsChat is the busiest, largest free family history forum site in the country. It is completely free to use. Register now.
Also register instantly with Facebook or Twitter (and other social networks). Start your genealogy search now.


Offline majm

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 21,519
  • NSW 1806 Bowman Flag Ecce signum.
    • View Profile
Re: Vernon Industrial School information help
« Reply #19 on: Wednesday 15 May 19 12:55 BST (UK) »
EDIT TO ALERT READERS TO SEE LATER REPLIES (#20 AND #21), THERE WERE TWO CHAPS.

So you know that you  have the d.c. for your George.  So no need to be confused.  One step at a time,  taken slowly forward.

1.  Deaths in hospital need to be certified by a medico,  and in some  jurisdictions any hospital death involves a coroner.  I am not sure if Qld required coroner to be notified.

2. A death in third week of May 1893 could be a death 17/5/93 and a funeral on the Sunday was not at all unusual in that era ...  it was a day of the week that most people were available ...

3.  Could the cemetery confirm the date your George was buried ... cemetery should be recorded on the d.c..... 

My fingers are crossed that there was just the one chap,  and there is some clerical error on the d.c. 

4.  Coroners have been known to issue burial orders for public health concerns  before they have finalised the coronial enquiries. 

5.  17 /05 / 93   v 17 /06 /93  d.c. likely has month of June written in full rather than as a number ...

Too late tonight to think more.

JM
The information in my posts is provided for academic and non-commercial research purposes. 

Random Acts of Kindness Given Freely are never Worthless for they are Priceless.

Qui scit et non docet.    Qui docet et non vivit.    Qui nescit et non interrogat.   

All Census Look Ups Are Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

I do not have a face book or a twitter account.

RootsChat is the busiest, largest free family history forum site in the country. It is completely free to use. Register now.
Also register instantly with Facebook or Twitter (and other social networks). Start your genealogy search now.


Offline majm

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 21,519
  • NSW 1806 Bowman Flag Ecce signum.
    • View Profile
Re: Vernon Industrial School information help
« Reply #20 on: Thursday 16 May 19 00:19 BST (UK) »
STARTING TO UNCONFUSE NOW  :D

Hi there,

FindMyPast has uploaded data provided by the Genealogical Society of Queensland

The Toowoomba Cemetery Parish Burials Index has TWO chaps burials of interest May and June 1893:

Index reference 2/52 is for a George CRIGHTON aged 47, buried 19 May 1893

Index reference 2/53 is for a George CRIGHTON aged 50, buried 19 June 1893. 

JM  (Clearer head this morning, so searched for Crighton as alternative to Creighton !)
The information in my posts is provided for academic and non-commercial research purposes. 

Random Acts of Kindness Given Freely are never Worthless for they are Priceless.

Qui scit et non docet.    Qui docet et non vivit.    Qui nescit et non interrogat.   

All Census Look Ups Are Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

I do not have a face book or a twitter account.

Offline majm

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 21,519
  • NSW 1806 Bowman Flag Ecce signum.
    • View Profile
Re: Vernon Industrial School information help
« Reply #21 on: Thursday 16 May 19 00:46 BST (UK) »
Qld BDM online index

C1427
George Henry CRIGHTON, with parents as Charles CRIGHTON and Mary WILLIAMS
the index drills down to 19 May 1893 as the date of death.

C1433
George CREIGHTON, with parents as Joseph CREIGHTON and Sarah HEPWORTH
the index drills down to 17 June 1893 as the date of death

https://www.qld.gov.au/law/births-deaths-marriages-and-divorces/family-history-research

JM
The information in my posts is provided for academic and non-commercial research purposes. 

Random Acts of Kindness Given Freely are never Worthless for they are Priceless.

Qui scit et non docet.    Qui docet et non vivit.    Qui nescit et non interrogat.   

All Census Look Ups Are Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

I do not have a face book or a twitter account.

Offline Kylie B

  • RootsChat Veteran
  • *****
  • Posts: 785
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Vernon Industrial School information help
« Reply #22 on: Thursday 16 May 19 00:58 BST (UK) »
Ah-ha!
Ok so that is much clearer.
So the 1st man was a member of the Lodge.

I wonder how long my George was in Toowoomba before he went into the asylum in 1892? And what took him there in the 1st place??

Back to trawl Trove further to see what I can discover. ..

Would there be anything to be gained from contacting the cemetery?

Thanks JM

Offline majm

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 21,519
  • NSW 1806 Bowman Flag Ecce signum.
    • View Profile
Re: Vernon Industrial School information help
« Reply #23 on: Thursday 16 May 19 01:09 BST (UK) »
If this was my ancestor, yes, I would contact the Cemetery and ask what information they hold, about BOTH graves, and are there charges for accessing their records, and can they help you with any further information about either George, to help you know how to isolate which George is which when you are continuing your research in their district   :)  :)  :) as you may be visiting the area in the coming months.   ;D  ;D    I would also compliment them on their great website, it even lists 'notables' and has background history... 

http://www.tr.qld.gov.au/facilities-recreation/cemeteries/cemetery-locations/3227-drayton-a-toowoomba

JM
The information in my posts is provided for academic and non-commercial research purposes. 

Random Acts of Kindness Given Freely are never Worthless for they are Priceless.

Qui scit et non docet.    Qui docet et non vivit.    Qui nescit et non interrogat.   

All Census Look Ups Are Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

I do not have a face book or a twitter account.

Offline Kylie B

  • RootsChat Veteran
  • *****
  • Posts: 785
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Vernon Industrial School information help
« Reply #24 on: Thursday 16 May 19 01:45 BST (UK) »
Hi JM- so glad we are not going mad....at least not with regard to this particular search!!

I have emailed the cemetery and will keep you posted on what I hear back. Thank you so much for all your help clarifying and advice on where to next!

Off to keep trawling Trove for any other clues.

Kylie

Offline Kylie B

  • RootsChat Veteran
  • *****
  • Posts: 785
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Vernon Industrial School information help
« Reply #25 on: Tuesday 28 May 19 07:09 BST (UK) »
An update  :)

So I heard back from the Cemetery in Toowoomba. They were very helpful, but had little additional info, other than to say it would appear George Creighton had a headstone at burial, but they are unsure if it is still there.

I contacted the local library where an amazingly helpful lady did some searching for me and found the following:
George Creighton was NOT on the electoral role for Toowoomba in 1890.
Cost for treatment at the Hospital for the insane was 25pounds on admission...Was that a lot of money in 1892? I am wondering about George having that sum of money on him??

The 'other' George Crighton was from Gehem, was a member of the local Lodge, had funeral notices published quite widely (not just locally) and was also buried at Toowoomba cemetery.

I have also heard back from the museum in Coonamble who said they are unsure where the court records from the 1880's are held, but suggested a search of the Police gazettes for that decade to look for mentions of Esther as apparently if she was arrested, it would be mentioned in there.

Does anyone have access to the police gazette's that can have a look for me please?

And I will contact the Toowoomba hospital directly and see if they hold records that are open and can be checked for more info on George.

Still open to any and all suggestions!!!!!!!

Offline majm

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 21,519
  • NSW 1806 Bowman Flag Ecce signum.
    • View Profile
Re: Vernon Industrial School information help
« Reply #26 on: Tuesday 28 May 19 23:42 BST (UK) »
NSW history re  state wards/neglected children in the colonial era can be difficult to find,  but there are historians who have undertaken research and published on this hidden topic.

Have you accessed any of the published books by Professor Ramsland?   And of course the lists of source materials in those books... it can be a confronting read , but it may be there will be quality tips that may bring new thoughts re existing resources to be examined ....

JM
The information in my posts is provided for academic and non-commercial research purposes. 

Random Acts of Kindness Given Freely are never Worthless for they are Priceless.

Qui scit et non docet.    Qui docet et non vivit.    Qui nescit et non interrogat.   

All Census Look Ups Are Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

I do not have a face book or a twitter account.