Author Topic: Was this an unusual relationship?  (Read 811 times)

Offline LizzieL

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Re: Was this an unusual relationship?
« Reply #9 on: Saturday 04 May 19 19:36 BST (UK) »
Just another thought - you are confident that the Elizabeth is the daughter of your Elizabeth (Derham) Butt.
However, are you also confident that the Peter Derham is Elizabeth (Derham) Butt's brother?

Because families did repeat first names, even if relatively close family members were also using them.
Have you ruled out that the Peter Derham was not the child of another branch of the family (eg son of one of George Derham's siblings?)
There are a few Peter Derhams but this is the only one with a matching birth year
Berks / Oxon: Eltham, Annetts, Wiltshire (surname not county), Hawkins, Pembroke, Partridge
Dorset / Hants: Derham, Stride, Purkiss, Scott, Sibley
Yorkshire: Pottage, Carr, Blackburn, Depledge
Sussex: Goodyer, Christopher, Trevatt
Jersey: Fowler, Huelin, Scott
Essex/Herts: Livermore, Holgate, Law, Day, Myson, Boyton
Norfolk/Suffolk: Stone, Alexander, Tipple, Ingate

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Offline Mabel Bagshawe

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Re: Was this an unusual relationship?
« Reply #10 on: Saturday 04 May 19 20:15 BST (UK) »
Hi believe Cecil G and Peter have been transcribed as DESHAM in 1939 at same address as 1911, interesting occupations ( as transcribed ) Ada E Butt is with them.
Keyboard86

Well it was not the deaths of Edmund Percy 1894 ( In London occ Clerk ) or Ernest Sydney b 1890 occ Officers Steward in the Royal Navy in 1911
Edgar William b 1887 died 1887 and Herbert b 1895 in1897 aged 1

Minnie Derham
Q1    1893   South Stoneham  Vol 2c, p45
Age at Death:    7


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Online keyboard86

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Re: Was this an unusual relationship?
« Reply #11 on: Saturday 04 May 19 22:45 BST (UK) »
Hi if Minnie Derham was registered in Dec qtr 1885 Totnes Devon mmn Butt and dies 1893 aged 7 South Stoneham where are family in 1891 as at present only have FindMyPast.
Keyboard86
Pelly/Pelley/Kingsbury/Challis/Nalder/Rochester/Raydenbow

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Online Maiden Stone

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Re: Was this an unusual relationship?
« Reply #12 on: Sunday 05 May 19 00:12 BST (UK) »
The column stated asks How many complete years the CURRENT marriage has lasted ;D
If she is a widow, the correct answer is zero.
But the next columns are for numbers of children born alive to present marriage. As a widow she should have left those blank too.
I think she wanted to record the children but couldn't lie about a non existent marriage.

This was the first time those questions had been asked on a census. I've seen several census returns on which answers to those questions were inaccurate/misleading/wrong, including my own family. Some people may have been confused.

Online candrjm

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Re: Was this an unusual relationship?
« Reply #13 on: Sunday 05 May 19 13:25 BST (UK) »
Link to the 1891 census:

https://www.freecen.org.uk/search_records/59033826e9379091b1fc23cc?search_id=5cced5c8791e3b156d37cfce


Lizzie you may have already found this info but just in case you haven't:

Ernest Sidney Derham in 1911 census:

https://tinyurl.com/y2wcld8p


Ernest Sydney  Derham married in Winchester in 1925  and died 18th December 1963 in Farnborough Hospital Kent

Probate 1964:
https://probatesearch.service.gov.uk/Calendar?surname=derham&yearOfDeath=1964&page=1#calendar


Edmund Percy Derham in 1911:

https://tinyurl.com/y34lywyj

Edmund Percy Derham married in 1923 (Southampton) and died in 1947 (Southampton)


Cecil George Derham died in M Q 1962 in Winchester

Offline LizzieL

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Re: Was this an unusual relationship?
« Reply #14 on: Sunday 05 May 19 17:31 BST (UK) »
Hi if Minnie Derham was registered in Dec qtr 1885 Totnes Devon mmn Butt and dies 1893 aged 7 South Stoneham where are family in 1891 as at present only have FindMyPast.
Keyboard86

Have never been able to find them in 1891, but there is a link to Totnes. Peter's sister Louisa had an illegitimate daughter Alice Louisa birth reg  in Holborn Q2 1861. On the birth registration she has put mother's maiden name as Footner, maybe confused and thought they wanted her mother's maiden name not her own maiden name. Alice married Frank Lester Harris in 1882 in Buckingham
 district. In 1891 Louisa is in Totnes with a widowed Frank Harris and his children
Berks / Oxon: Eltham, Annetts, Wiltshire (surname not county), Hawkins, Pembroke, Partridge
Dorset / Hants: Derham, Stride, Purkiss, Scott, Sibley
Yorkshire: Pottage, Carr, Blackburn, Depledge
Sussex: Goodyer, Christopher, Trevatt
Jersey: Fowler, Huelin, Scott
Essex/Herts: Livermore, Holgate, Law, Day, Myson, Boyton
Norfolk/Suffolk: Stone, Alexander, Tipple, Ingate

Online keyboard86

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Re: Was this an unusual relationship?
« Reply #15 on: Sunday 05 May 19 17:34 BST (UK) »
 :) See reply above for 1891?
Keyboard86
Pelly/Pelley/Kingsbury/Challis/Nalder/Rochester/Raydenbow

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Offline LizzieL

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Re: Was this an unusual relationship?
« Reply #16 on: Sunday 05 May 19 17:50 BST (UK) »
:) See reply above for 1891?
Keyboard86

Thanks I missed that reply
And thank you very much candrjm. I wonder why I couldn't find it.
Berks / Oxon: Eltham, Annetts, Wiltshire (surname not county), Hawkins, Pembroke, Partridge
Dorset / Hants: Derham, Stride, Purkiss, Scott, Sibley
Yorkshire: Pottage, Carr, Blackburn, Depledge
Sussex: Goodyer, Christopher, Trevatt
Jersey: Fowler, Huelin, Scott
Essex/Herts: Livermore, Holgate, Law, Day, Myson, Boyton
Norfolk/Suffolk: Stone, Alexander, Tipple, Ingate

Online keyboard86

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Re: Was this an unusual relationship?
« Reply #17 on: Sunday 05 May 19 17:54 BST (UK) »
 :) If you look back at your thread, you will see where the remaining 4 were situated?
Keyboard86

PS 1891 not on FindMyPast
Pelly/Pelley/Kingsbury/Challis/Nalder/Rochester/Raydenbow

UK Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk