Author Topic: Regiment on death cert 1856 Scotland  (Read 617 times)

Offline Flemming

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Re: Regiment on death cert 1856 Scotland
« Reply #18 on: Sunday 19 May 19 10:39 BST (UK) »
Thanks for the replies, and that'll teach me to rely on Wiki for info  ;)

Quote
24th Regiment of Foot - 24th (The 2nd Warwickshire) Regiment of Foot - South Wales Borderers

I'm not familiar with the official Stations of the British Army but, for example, for the 26th, does the entry mean they were in Canada in Jan 1855 with a home depot in Newcastle (presumably 'upon Tyne'); in Bermuda in Dec 1855 with a home depot in Chatham; etc.?

With another army family, I've got the wife moving with the husband - so is it feasible that the children were conceived in England when husband was stationed at a depot, then wife returned to Scotland/family to have the baby?

The fact that he's recorded as stone miner on an 1859 death cert makes me think he emerged from the army unscathed but you never know with family history, do you?  ???

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Offline Flemming

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Re: Regiment on death cert 1856 Scotland
« Reply #19 on: Sunday 19 May 19 10:40 BST (UK) »
I have added "until post 1881" to my post above.

MaxD

Yes, and I should have read Wiki more carefully...

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but was not called the South Wales Borderers until the Childers Reforms of 1881.

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Offline Regorian

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Re: Regiment on death cert 1856 Scotland
« Reply #20 on: Sunday 19 May 19 11:05 BST (UK) »
Don't worry Flemming, I've made a few howlers relying on Wiki in the past. It's not a bad starting point, but there are usually other regimental websites available for comparison and correction of Wiki.
Griffiths Llandogo, Mitcheltroy, Mon. and Whitchurch Here (Also Edwards),  18th C., Griffiths FoD 19th Century.

Offline MaxD

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Re: Regiment on death cert 1856 Scotland
« Reply #21 on: Sunday 19 May 19 11:06 BST (UK) »
Stations of the army was a monthly War Office listing of which unit was where published in a number of newspapers (I access the FindMyPast selection) and you read the extract correctly.

BUT - this can provide only an overview.  Elements of a regiment were not always stationed in the same place and the listing tends only to show the main station.  In Jan 1855 for example the depot was about to move from Newcastle to Belfast.  Much more detailed research is needed on a regiment month by month to be relatively sure where they all were.

The scenario you posit with the soldier's wife is totally feasible.

I may be wrong but I don't think you have ever posted his name?

MaxD
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Offline Flemming

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Re: Regiment on death cert 1856 Scotland
« Reply #22 on: Sunday 19 May 19 15:23 BST (UK) »
He was William Small. I've found ten in the relevant time period on FindMyPast. The closest to 2?th is one in the 20th (found in an invalid depot in Gillingham in 1861 and recorded as 'widow'); and two in the 21st (one has no birth details, the other was discharged in 1882 by which time his wife had been a widow - allegedly - for at least ten years).

To summarise conception dates, child 1 would have been conceived c. August 1855; child 2 c. April 1857; and child 3 (if William was the father) during 1859 or (more likely) 1860. Before all of these, another may have been conceived 1853-4.

His wife was born in Ireland c 1827 and there's a William Small in Old Monkland in 1861 (where she was also living) born 1815/6 Ireland - although there's also one in neighbouring parish New Monkland born 1820/1 Ireland. My money's on the former as he's recorded as an ironstone miner; the latter is a labourer.

Offline MaxD

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Re: Regiment on death cert 1856 Scotland
« Reply #23 on: Sunday 19 May 19 18:47 BST (UK) »
A difficulty is that, assuming he was serving at the time of his death, there will be no pension record for him and any other documents would have been thrown away.  The army didn't keep records for men who died in service.
You've already seen that there is no Crimea medal entry for a William Small in any of the 5 (or is it 6) possible interpretations of the regiment.
Where he will appear is some where in the muster books and pay lists of whichever regiment he was with.  Again, IF he was serving when he died then there would be an entry in the relevant quarter of 1856 and, if found, he could be back tracked to other relevant dates.
Taking 24th Foot as an example, there are two muster books covering 1856 https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/browse/r/h/C150227/cnext/C150227/C2463925
There will be similar documents for each of the other possibles.

Needs a researcher to visit Kew and go through each of them.  Otherwise it is needle in haystack time except we can't find the haystack!

MaxD
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Offline Flemming

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Re: Regiment on death cert 1856 Scotland
« Reply #24 on: Monday 20 May 19 16:26 BST (UK) »
Needs a researcher to visit Kew and go through each of them. Otherwise it is needle in haystack time except we can't find the haystack!

True, and I don't feel there's enough certainty yet to pay for a researcher. I'll search again for the family in 1861, and also see if I can find a civil death registration for William. I just have a feeling he survived a short stint in the army and need to (at least try) ruling it in or out.

Thanks again for the help and interest.

BW
Flemming