Author Topic: Betsal, Bestall, Bestil, Bestel, Bestle in Avoca, Co Wicklow  (Read 3383 times)

Offline hallmark

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Re: Re: Re: Re: William Bestal
« Reply #27 on: Monday 15 April 19 12:27 BST (UK) »



Listening to too much gossip!


e.g.


 Maynooth College was founded in 1795 as a seminary for the education of priests and by 1850 had become the largest seminary in the world. 

The College was founded because it was urgently needed. In the seventeenth and eighteenth centuries it had not been possible to educate Catholic priests in Ireland. Institutions had been established in Catholic Europe, where they had become concentrated in France. The French Revolution confiscated all of these in 1792 and 1793. In Ireland the Penal Code was being dismantled, and the British Government, at war with revolutionary France, was anxious to placate Irish Catholic dissatisfactions, and certainly did not wish to see ‘revolutionary’ priests returning from the continent. In consequence, a petition to Parliament by the Irish Catholic Bishops was successful, and ‘An Act for the better education of persons professing the Popish or Roman Catholic religion’ was passed in June 1795. It provided a modest grant to establish a college.




R.C's were educated!!




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Offline hallmark

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Re: Re: Re: Re: William Bestal
« Reply #28 on: Monday 15 April 19 12:33 BST (UK) »


Another...


Charles Gavan Duffy was born in Monaghan Town on the 12th April 1816. The son of a Catholic shopkeeper, his parents died when he was very young and he was raised by his uncle Father James Duffy, the Parish Priest of Castleblayney.   Duffy was educated at St Malachy’s college in Belfast and was admitted to the Irish Bar in 1845.



What is omitted is that he attended the C of I school in Monaghan prior to college!!



Daniel O'Connell was a Barrister.....
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Offline tmusabotf

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Re: Re: Re: Re: William Bestal
« Reply #29 on: Monday 15 April 19 13:38 BST (UK) »
It’s not gossip, Priests were educated as the powers that Be didn’t want further uprisings since the one in the late 1600’s but it was difficult for poorer people to get that education due to costs and lack of facilities. I have saw the post before of a catholic being educated in an COI Trinity College, it appears to be a rare occurrence. The problem lies further back to the 1600’s and into the late 1700’s whereby atrocious laws existed.

I have no preference for either religion and I don’t  know all  the ins and outs of what went on but it is true RC in the main at that time were kept down by law and although these laws were later repealed it took years on end to sort things out properly. Poorer Presbyterians also faced problems with being educated.

Here are a few examples of such facts and laws which caused impact into the 1800’s

* no doubt this one applied to all children regardless of religion *  -  If you were a child in the early nineteenth century you were not able to go to a national school paid for by the government because they did not exist until the 1830's. Large numbers of children still went to school in the 1800's but in most cases they had to pay to attend so if you were poor or had a big family it would have been unlikely all children from a poor family if any  were able to attend school at that time. Perhaps even being only able to afford educating one child.
* Exclusion of Catholics from most public offices (since 1607), Presbyterians were also barred from public office from 1707.
* Ban on intermarriage with Protestants; repealed 1778
* Exclusion from the legal professions and the judiciary; repealed (respectively) 1793 and 1829
**** Bar to Catholics and Protestant Dissenters entering Trinity College Dublin; repealed 1793.****
*** On a death by a Catholic, his legatee could benefit by conversion to the Church of Ireland; ***
*** Popery Act – Catholic inheritances of land were to be equally subdivided between all an owner's sons with the exception that if the eldest son and heir converted to Protestantism that he would become the one and only tenant of estate and portions for other children not to exceed one third of the estate. This "Gavelkind" system had previously been abolished by 1600.***
* Ban on converting from Protestantism to Roman Catholicism on pain of Praemunire: forfeiting all property estates and legacy to the monarch of the time and remaining in prison at the monarch's pleasure. In addition, forfeiting the monarch's protection. No injury however atrocious could have any action brought against it or any reparation for such.
*** Ban on Catholics inheriting Protestant land***
* Prohibition on Catholics owning a horse valued at over £5 (to keep horses suitable for military activity out of the majority's hands)
* Roman Catholic lay priests had to register to preach under the Registration Act 1704, but seminary priests and Bishops were not able to do so until 1778
* When allowed, new Catholic churches were to be built from wood, not stone, and away from main roads.
* 'No person of the popish religion shall publicly or in private houses teach school, or instruct youth in learning within this realm' upon pain of twenty pounds fine and three months in prison for every such offence. Repealed in 1782.[8]
* Any and all rewards not paid by the crown for alerting authorities of offences to be levied upon the Catholic populace within parish and county

Sorry this is detracting from Audley again but I’m trying to point out why there was a possible disinheriting/disowning of William Bestal who was probably born between 1800-1840, perhaps even born earlier and more than likely related to Audley as both from Rathdrum.

Strangely enough the Bestall ancestors I have found so far appear to have been quite poor but out of that poorness and with some of the family struggling to obtain higher education due to costs, sacrifices were made and we have currently well educated family members some of which are surgeons, one of which who carries out the most complex and dangerous type of surgery you can get. So although there has been episodes of non education, the brains still clearly exist

I’m not posting on this thread again as enough has been said and has detracted from minimac Original post



Offline sarah

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Re: Betsal, Bestall, Bestil, Bestel, Bestle in Avoca, Co Wicklow
« Reply #30 on: Saturday 13 July 19 17:33 BST (UK) »
Hi,

I have hopefully separated the two thread that had become mixed up into two correctly.

Other topics on the family here

https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=798592.0

and here

https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=274044.0

Regards

Sarah
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