Author Topic: Imbecile (spine)  (Read 2799 times)

Offline Turtle Dove

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Imbecile (spine)
« on: Tuesday 06 August 19 15:37 BST (UK) »
I have an ancestor who was 33 in 1871. His occupation was canal labourer but it also says 'imbecile (spine). Can anyone tell me what the significance of the spine was? He died two years later.

Offline Craclyn

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Re: Imbecile (spine)
« Reply #1 on: Tuesday 06 August 19 15:54 BST (UK) »
My initial thought was that it might be an attempt to explain spina bifida, but that seems less likely if he had the occupation of canal worker.
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Offline stanmapstone

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Re: Imbecile (spine)
« Reply #2 on: Tuesday 06 August 19 16:10 BST (UK) »
The exact definitions of terms such as 'lunatic', 'imbecile', 'idiot' and 'feeble-minded' are extremely problematic.
According to the 1881 Census Report;
No accurate line of demarcation can be drawn between the several conditions indicated by these terms. Speaking generally, however, the term idiot is applied in popular usage simply to those who suffer from congenital mental deficiency, and the term imbecile to persons who have fallen in later life into a state of chronic dementia. But it is certain that neither this nor any other definite distinction between the terms was rigorously observed in the schedules, and consequently no attempt has been made by us to separate imbeciles from idiots. The term lunatic also is used with some vagueness, and probably some persons suffering from congenital idiocy, and many more suffering from dementia, were returned under this name.
Considering that householders, who could be illiterate, were being asked to give information about medical disabilities without any definition of the terms being used the answers should be treated with caution. Also they would be unwilling to admit  that anyone in the family had medical disabilities.



Stan
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Offline josey

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Re: Imbecile (spine)
« Reply #3 on: Tuesday 06 August 19 16:14 BST (UK) »
Just a thought - are you absolutely sure it says 'spine'? The writing can be appalling as we know on some census returns. We'd be happy to take a look if you can either post a snippet or give us the census reference.
Seeking: RC baptism Philip Murray Feb ish 1814 ? nr Chatham Kent.
IRE: Kik DRAY[EA], PURCELL, WHITE: Mea LYNCH: Tip MURRAY, SHEEDY: Wem ALLEN, ENGLISHBY; Dub PENROSE: Lim DUNN[E], FRAWLEY, WILLIAMS.
87th Regiment RIF: MURRAY
ENG; Marylebone HAYTER, TROU[W]SDALE, WILLIAMS,DUNEVAN Con HAMPTON, TREMELLING Wry CLEGG, HOLLAND, HORSEFIELD Coventry McGINTY
CAN; Halifax & Pictou: HOLLAND, WHITE, WILLIAMSON


Offline River Tyne Lass

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Re: Imbecile (spine)
« Reply #4 on: Tuesday 06 August 19 16:20 BST (UK) »
Perhaps he had scoliosis (hope this is correct spelling)- a deformity of the spine.  I have a relative who had this and it had to be corrected with straightening rods put in during surgery.  Sadly, I don't think there would have been that type of intervention available back then.
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Offline josey

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Re: Imbecile (spine)
« Reply #5 on: Tuesday 06 August 19 16:25 BST (UK) »
But spina bifida & scoliosis surely wouldn't justify the description imbecile? Do you have the death certificate or cause of death, Turtle Dove?
Seeking: RC baptism Philip Murray Feb ish 1814 ? nr Chatham Kent.
IRE: Kik DRAY[EA], PURCELL, WHITE: Mea LYNCH: Tip MURRAY, SHEEDY: Wem ALLEN, ENGLISHBY; Dub PENROSE: Lim DUNN[E], FRAWLEY, WILLIAMS.
87th Regiment RIF: MURRAY
ENG; Marylebone HAYTER, TROU[W]SDALE, WILLIAMS,DUNEVAN Con HAMPTON, TREMELLING Wry CLEGG, HOLLAND, HORSEFIELD Coventry McGINTY
CAN; Halifax & Pictou: HOLLAND, WHITE, WILLIAMSON

Offline stanmapstone

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Re: Imbecile (spine)
« Reply #6 on: Tuesday 06 August 19 16:28 BST (UK) »
But spina bifida & scoliosis surely wouldn't justify the description imbecile?

As I posted Considering that householders, who could be illiterate, were being asked to give information about medical disabilities without any definition of the terms being used the answers should be treated with caution.

Stan
Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline River Tyne Lass

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Re: Imbecile (spine)
« Reply #7 on: Tuesday 06 August 19 16:36 BST (UK) »
I wonder if the person may possibly have had a spinal problem and perhaps in addition some type of disability which might have led to the description of 'imbecile'.
Conroy, Fitzpatrick, Watson, Miller, Davis/Davies, Brown, Senior, Dodds, Grieveson, Gamesby, Simpson, Rose, Gilboy, Malloy, Dalton, Young, Saint, Anderson, Allen, McKetterick, McCabe, Drummond, Parkinson, Armstrong, McCarroll, Innes, Marshall, Atkinson, Glendinning, Fenwick, Bonner

Offline Turtle Dove

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Re: Imbecile (spine)
« Reply #8 on: Tuesday 06 August 19 17:11 BST (UK) »
Here's the entry. He died in Stafford asylum (lunacy record) He was admitted in November 1873 and died in April 1874. I think I had better get a death certificate.