Author Topic: Margaret Gray, Margaret Hay aka Maggie Gray or Maggie Hay or Margaret Gray Hay  (Read 2001 times)

Offline tbears52

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Margaret Gray, Margaret Hay aka Maggie Gray or Maggie Hay or Margaret Gray Hay
« on: Thursday 19 September 19 08:22 BST (UK) »
Hello from mid north coast, New South Wales, Australia.

We, my cousin and myself are trying to solve the mystery of her 2nd Great Grandmother an my 2nd cousin three times removed.

Brief history Margaret Gray was born to Robert Gray and Janet nee King in Uddingston, Parish of Bothwell in 1845.  She married William Inglis Hay in 1872.

Margaret or "Maggie" as she was also known as went missing after the 1881 Scotland Census (living in Paisley with her husband and two children )and she was finally located in the 1891 Scotland Census as an inpatient at Woodilee Lunatic Asylum, Lenzie Parish of Kirkintilloch & County Dumbarton.  Maggie Gray was discharged from this facility in 1895.  No record has been located for her in the 1901 or 1911 Scotland Census.

After many wrong purchases for Death Registrations she was finally located as passing at Ayton Cottage, Blebo Craigs, Fife in 1932. 

A search of the Scottish Post Office Directories did not locate Maggie at all between discharge and her passing.  However in the 1935 Scottish Post Office Directories revealed an Agnes Hay living at Ayton Cottage and a Valuation Roll for 1935 at Blebo Craigs, Parish of Kemback reveals an Agnes Hay as a Tenant of John Murray at Blebo Craigs.  Agnes Hay could quite possible a relative by marriage but we are unable to find any connection.

Has anyone ever looked into Blebo Craigs and would they be able to advise where I may approach to see if further information can be located.  I feel like I have exhausted everything but you never know.

Thank you for reading this message, I hope you can help my cousin and myself.   Judi

Offline kirstyfairfull

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Re: Margaret Gray, Margaret Hay aka Maggie Gray or Maggie Hay or Margaret Gray Hay
« Reply #1 on: Thursday 19 September 19 13:22 BST (UK) »
Hello tbears52 , Google Fife Family History Society  in Cupar they have a wealth of info and are the best to contact .Cupar is not far from Blebo Craigs  sorry can,t help more .Kirstyfairfull.
Dundee. Pullar, Gray, Calman,Halket.
Fife, Auchterlonie, Binnie, Briggs,Dempster,Herd,Mann,Kidd, Grubb, Rollo,Henderson,McLaren, Fairfull,Weir. Just to name a few.

Offline Rosinish

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Re: Margaret Gray, Margaret Hay aka Maggie Gray or Maggie Hay or Margaret Gray Hay
« Reply #2 on: Thursday 19 September 19 16:34 BST (UK) »
Who was the informant on the DC & was their address given?

Annie

Edit to add...My Reply #5 has the informant details.
South Uist, Inverness-shire, Scotland:- Bowie, Campbell, Cumming, Currie

Ireland:- Cullen, Flannigan (Derry), Donahoe/Donaghue (variants) (Cork), McCrate (Tipperary), Mellon, Tol(l)and (Donegal & Tyrone)

Newcastle-on-Tyne/Durham (Northumberland):- Harrison, Jude, Kemp, Lunn, Mellon, Robson, Stirling

Kettering, Northampton:- MacKinnon

Canada:- Callaghan, Cumming, MacPhee

"OLD GENEALOGISTS NEVER DIE - THEY JUST LOSE THEIR CENSUS"

Offline Rosinish

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Re: Margaret Gray, Margaret Hay aka Maggie Gray or Maggie Hay or Margaret Gray Hay
« Reply #3 on: Thursday 19 September 19 17:08 BST (UK) »
A Tree on Anc* has her as Margaret Lawrie Fleming Gray i.e. may have used middle initials on census records?

The tree has a newspaper attachment for Unclaimed Mail (1882 Brooklyn, New York) for Mrs Wm Gray but there's no indication otherwise to say this was her?

Annie
South Uist, Inverness-shire, Scotland:- Bowie, Campbell, Cumming, Currie

Ireland:- Cullen, Flannigan (Derry), Donahoe/Donaghue (variants) (Cork), McCrate (Tipperary), Mellon, Tol(l)and (Donegal & Tyrone)

Newcastle-on-Tyne/Durham (Northumberland):- Harrison, Jude, Kemp, Lunn, Mellon, Robson, Stirling

Kettering, Northampton:- MacKinnon

Canada:- Callaghan, Cumming, MacPhee

"OLD GENEALOGISTS NEVER DIE - THEY JUST LOSE THEIR CENSUS"


Offline ColC

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Re: Margaret Gray, Margaret Hay aka Maggie Gray or Maggie Hay or Margaret Gray Hay
« Reply #4 on: Thursday 19 September 19 17:08 BST (UK) »
ROBERT GRAY   Married    JANET KING/   17/01/1829   Kilmaurs, Ayrshire

If this is the correct marriage I see on https://www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk that they had a number of children in various parts of Lanarkshire but I do not see a Margaret among them, do you have a birth/baptism record?

Agnes Hay was at Ayton Cottage on Valuation Roll 1925/1930/1935 at Blebo Craigs but not 1940.

Colin
Clarke, Trickett, Orton, Lawless, Norton, Detheridge, Kirby, Goodfellow, Wagstaff, Lowe, etc.

Offline Rosinish

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Re: Margaret Gray, Margaret Hay aka Maggie Gray or Maggie Hay or Margaret Gray Hay
« Reply #5 on: Thursday 19 September 19 17:39 BST (UK) »
DC on Anc. gives Eliza Hay (Sister-in-Law), Wetheral Plains, Carlisle.

William had been a Banker.

Tree has William Inglis Hay death 29 Jan 1904 Manhattan, New York, USA

It may be worth checking Immigration & US census records.

Edit...Info. from tree, William (Chartered Accountant) was in England 1901 census & remarried to Myra Josephine Putland

I would assume the Mrs M Wm Hay to have been Myra & unlikely Margaret was in the USA (apologies).

Annie
South Uist, Inverness-shire, Scotland:- Bowie, Campbell, Cumming, Currie

Ireland:- Cullen, Flannigan (Derry), Donahoe/Donaghue (variants) (Cork), McCrate (Tipperary), Mellon, Tol(l)and (Donegal & Tyrone)

Newcastle-on-Tyne/Durham (Northumberland):- Harrison, Jude, Kemp, Lunn, Mellon, Robson, Stirling

Kettering, Northampton:- MacKinnon

Canada:- Callaghan, Cumming, MacPhee

"OLD GENEALOGISTS NEVER DIE - THEY JUST LOSE THEIR CENSUS"

Offline ColC

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Re: Margaret Gray, Margaret Hay aka Maggie Gray or Maggie Hay or Margaret Gray Hay
« Reply #6 on: Thursday 19 September 19 17:46 BST (UK) »
I realise you may know the following but it may help others?

1881 Cleopatric Buildings, 1, Middle Church, Paisley, Renfrewshire
William Inglis   Hay   Head   Married   33   1848   Engineers Clerk   Glasgow, Lanarkshire, Scotland
Maggie Gray   Hay   Wife   Married   35   1846   -   Uddingston, Lanarkshire, Scotland
Annie Ethel   Hay   Daughter   -   5   1876   -   Uddingston, Lanarkshire, Scotland
John Ritchie   Hay   Son   -   2   1879      

WILLIAM HAY/ELIZABETH INGLIS
JOHN 24/07/1846 Glasgow
WILLIAM INGLIS 22/10/1847 Glasgow
ROBERT 29/04/1849 Barony
JANET ERSKINE  Barony

William I. Hay to Maggie Lawrie Fleming Gray 6 Feb 1872 Bothwell, Lanark

There are possible marriages for John & Robert to an Agnes but I cannot find any census or other records to be sure.

Colin
Clarke, Trickett, Orton, Lawless, Norton, Detheridge, Kirby, Goodfellow, Wagstaff, Lowe, etc.

Offline tbears52

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Re: Margaret Gray, Margaret Hay aka Maggie Gray or Maggie Hay or Margaret Gray Hay
« Reply #7 on: Thursday 19 September 19 23:55 BST (UK) »
Thank you very much Kirstyfairfull, Rosinish and ColC for your replies. 

I will refer to her as Margaret which is the name I have known her for a number of years however it appears she may have been known as Maggie, starting at which time I do not know.

To address your responses I will start at the beginning of them to make things easier.

Kirstyfairfull, thank you for the Family History Society in Cupar, I will make contact with them.

Rosinish, thank you for the information you located.  The tree you located on Ancestry with the information is my cousin's tree.  I am helping her add to family history.  I have been researching for over 47 years now and whilst she has been researching for quite a number of years this part of the family history (her full lineage) has always remained a bit of a mystery.

The family has so many twists and turns.  The unclaimed letter for a Mrs Wm Gray was not Margaret, we believe it could possibly have been the lady William Hay may have formed a relationship with.  We cannot prove this at this stage. 

William and Margaret had two children Annie Ethel Hay in Scotland and then John Ritchie Hay while the couple were in Assenhole, West Bengal, India.  Both these two children ended up living out their lives in Australia.

Sadly the two children were spirited away to the United States, without Margaret's knowledge arriving 6 September 1883.  They were actually told their mother died of Bright's disease.  The children resided with a sister of the lady William had formed a relationship with (but never married).  Her name was Maria Josephine Putland but went by many different christian names.

Annie and John returned to Scotland arriving Glasgow February 1891.  They lived with William's mother and appear in the 1891 Scotland Census.

For some reason documentation shows William, purporting to be a Widower, being admitted to a Hospital & Asylum in Liverpool, New South Wales, having lived on his own means which were now exhausted.  He was admitted on 1.9.1898 and discharged by request 9.9.1898.  He was again admitted 21.9.1898 and discharged by request 1.10.1898.

William is next found living in England in the 1901 England Census with his "spouse" Myra J Hay.  Myra or Maria had been living in the USA and arrived 1884. 

To muddy the waters William had placed Margaret into Glasgow Royal Asylum, Gartnavel on 6 March 1882 as a private patient.  She was later transferred to Woodilee 25 August 1883 by Authority of Dr Mitchell.  Margaret was Discharged Relieved 5 July 1895.  We have the records for Margaret

William, Maggie and their two children Annie and John were living in Paisley, Renfrew at the time of the 1881 Census.

The informant on Margaret's Death Certificate is Elizabeth Gray, sister-in-law to Margaret.  Elizabeth had married George Gray, Margaret's younger brother.

It was by pure chance that I located the deaths of William and Myra in 1904.  Their deaths were caused by "Asphysxia by Illuminating Gas Accidental".  They had been back and forward to the USA between 1903 and 1904. 

On their State of New York Certificate and Record of Death it is stated they had been married for 20 years which is totally not true as William and Margaret never divorced.

It also seems that William's actual profession could have been glorified over time.  More than likely he was a Book Keeper / Clerk.  No reference can be found to him being a Banker.

It would seem that William certainly did not cover himself in glory at all in relation to his lawful wife Margaret.  She was turned from a Private Patient into a Pauper Patient.

Colin, thank you for your information.  Robert Gray married Janet King my 3 x Great Great Aunt, sister to my 3 x Great Great Grandmother Elizabeth King.

Margaret comes from the marriage of this couple's first born son George Gray who married Ann Jack in 1844.  Margaret was this couple's first born child being born in 1845.  Ann died 1878 at "Bankhead", Uddingston, Parish of Bothwell.  George died 1890 at Manor Place, Dunedin, New Zealand, a week after arriving to visit his brother.

I will now go back to look at the Valuations Rolls for 1925 and 1930, I just purchased the one for 1935, thank you for this.

Before I forget, the Gray Family were Agricultural Implement Makers from Uddingston and 3 of the sons settling in New Zealand and two other sons passing in Queensland, although only one can be located with a Death Registration.  The family business was started with George Gray in the early 1800s and many awards were won by the businesses.  They exported to Canada, New Zealand, Australia and I also believe Ireland as well.

In relation to John Hay, he married Elizabeth Baillie Hiddleston in 1868.  She passed away 1921 and John in 1927 both in Glasgow.  Robert Hay never married and passed away in 1921 Glasgow.

If Margaret was in fact in the care of Agnes Hay then it is highly likely to have been an Agnes marrying into the Hay family or perhaps a relative of the Hay family themselves.  This will need further looking into.

Hopefully I have been able to answer your comments right.  The hunt for Margaret continues.

Edit: The sad thing is that Margaret never knew what happened to her children and her children did not know Margaret was alive before leaving Scotland to start new lives in Australia.

With grateful thanks.  Judi

Offline tbears52

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Re: Margaret Gray, Margaret Hay aka Maggie Gray or Maggie Hay or Margaret Gray Hay
« Reply #8 on: Monday 27 December 21 21:54 GMT (UK) »
I wanted to let you know after more than two years of researching high and low and with the help of a wonderful gentleman at the Fife Family History Society Maggie has been brought home to her family in Australia and a Memorial Tablet has been placed on her Lair.

Maggie was a lady lost to her children but is now a lady found by her descendants and brought home to them.

Kind regards
Judi