Hayes/ Hay family from Killinchy/ Killyleagh

[lcar]

Hey everyone

I am hoping someone can help with this.

I have traced some of my family members to New Zealand and have been in touch with them. Bit of a long story but a sister of my grandad’s was taken there by a family member when she was 3 and I only found out about her during my research into my family.

Her sons have found a family bible with ‘Robert Hayes 1868’ on the front of it and none of them have a clue why it is in their possession.

Inside the bible is a note of marriage of Robert Hayes to Jane Brown in 27 November 1873 at Killinchy Presbyterian Church by Rev. David R. Moore.

There is also a note of 2 births - James Finlay Hayes and Thomas Hayes. There is no additional info other than their names. I have found a birth for James via family search - James Finlay Hay (not Hayes) born 17 August 1874 at Killyleagh. Parents are Robert Hay and Jane Brown Hay. I am assuming Thomas Hayes is also their child but I can’t find a thing for him.

My newly discovered NZ family have no idea how this bible came into their possession. They have no clue who Robert Hayes and his family are.

Through my previous research, I know my 3 x great grandmother was Elizabeth Hayes. She was born about 1836 in Killinchy, Co. Down. She married James McClure in Killinchy (at same church as Robert & Jane) in 1857. She moved to NZ with her husband around 1861. My NZ family were not aware of her or any connection to Hayes or McClure families until I found them about 2 months ago and told them what I had discovered.

Despite constant searching I can’tfind who Robert’s parents were. I know Elizabeth Hayes’ parents were Thomas Hayes, born abt. 1815, Ballymacreely and Mary McMillan born abt. 1821, Co. Down. They married 18 May 1837 again at Killinchy Presbyterian Church.

I have a feeling Robert who’s bible
my family has found is the brother of Elizabeth Hayes but I am having serious trouble finding anything out.

Would anyone have any pointers for me please?

Any help would be much appreciated

[aghadowey]

The marriage gives Glasgow as his address but father Thomas Hayes, a labourer-
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1873/11284/8139702.pdf

[aghadowey]

A Mary Hay was the informant when James Finlay Hay was born- perhaps Robert's mother?
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1874/03141/2151792.pdf

Thomas Hayes, widower, died 1901, grandson Robert-
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1901/05721/4614583.pdf
http://census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Down/Killinchy/Balloo/1230141/
Wife Mary died 1894-
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1894/05980/4700490.pdf

May be related?
http://census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Down/Killinchy/Balloo/239437/

[lcar]

Aghadowey! Wow. I am shocked and so happy at what you have managed to find where I have failed miserably despite searching and searching.

It does look like my 3 x great grandmother, Elizabeth Hayes and Robert Hayes were siblings as they seem to share the same parents.

I was born and raised in Glasgow and still live there. So it is strange than Robert Hayes was here too before he got married.

I will need to look into that & see if I can find him in a census.

Thank you so, so much for all of this info you have provided me with. It is much appreciated.

God only knows how this family bible ended up in the hands of my NZ family who knew nothing of their mother’s origins.

Thank you!

[lcar]

Thank you for info on the additional family members who could also be related to me.

I will have a wee look into those.

You have been so, so helpful.

Thank you so much again

[Sunnyhill]

My Hayes family are from Killinchy as well but unrelated to yours as far as I know. There is an Ancestry tree belonging to  kinnigit with your family in it - is that yours?

[lcar]

My Hayes family are from Killinchy as well but unrelated to yours as far as I know. There is an Ancestry tree belonging to  kinnigit with your family in it - is that yours?

Hey Sunnyhill

That is interesting that you come from the Hayes from Killinchy.  I wonder if we could find a link to each other?

The whole Hayes story is a bit of mystery to me.  One that I am slowly unravelling but it has lead to more questions than answers.

The kinnigit profile on Ancestry is a distant relative of mine who lives in New Zealand.  She is related to me through my great, great grandfather John Hayes McClure who was born in Killinchy Ireland.  She is a descendant of John's brother.  She wasn't aware of John or his descendants.  John Hayes McClure's parents were Elizabeth Hayes and James McClure who left Killinchy, Ireland in about 1860 and went to NZ. My 2 x great grandfather John Hayes McClure was born in Killinchy before they left to go to NZ but for some strange reason they never took him with them.  I can't find what year he was born despite searching and searching for his birth.

John Hayes McClure's sons Thomas and Robert ended up moving to NZ in about 1922 but we don't think they were aware that their father's parents and his brothers and sisters were all over there.  I know that the descendants of John Hayes McClure's siblings were not aware of him (John) at all.  This is why it is puzzling that Thomas (John's son) ended up having the family bible that belonged to Robert Hayes.  None of Thomas' descendants were aware of who the Hayes were or their link to Killinchy in Ireland and also Killinchy in NZ.

I have been trying to solve the mystery of why my 2 x great grandfather wasn't taken to NZ with his parents and how he ended up in Scotland and marrying a Scottish girl in 1882. 

[Sunnyhill]

Hi Icar
Just sent you a pm.
Looking at your cousin's tree, he / she has your Thomas b abt 1815 as son of Robert Hay and Mary Spratt. I have been in touch with @Colinm on here whose ancestors are also this Robert and Mary. His family also migrated to New Zealand though I think he doesn't have them having son Thomas. I can put you in touch with him if you like.
I sent you a link to my Ancestry tree but my ancestor James Gourley Hayes b 1827 Ballymacreelly [Killinchy] had father Archibald who I estimate was b abt 1790. He would be the right vintage to be brother of Robert m Mary Spratt but no evidence for connection except they also had a son Archibald.
Best wishes
David

[BallyaltikilliganG]

I think if you haven’t searched for all spelling variants you may miss out connections examples for Hay – Hayes- Hays [if I repeat one or more of Aghadoweys important referencesits because she always comes up with them and in turn they inspire me to try to help. You both sound experienced researchers so hoping I am replying in the spirit of help even if all known to you
Griffiths Valuation 1863 http://www.askaboutireland.ie/griffith-valuation/ using Killinchy only [there are more under Killyleagh inc a Robert in Derryboy]
Hay   Sophia      Killinchy   Killinchy   
Hay   Hugh      Carrigullian   Killinchy more detail needed   
could be the freeholder Hugh below of Ballymacreelly land
Hay   Hugh      Ballymacreelly   Killinchy   map ref 63 he is a freeholder just has land 2 roods 30 perches
Hay   Thomas   Ballymacreelly   Killinchy   D map ref 7,8,9.  as house and office  £2 fifteen shillingspa. the land has about 41 acres in small bits
Hay   Thomas   Balloo Killinchy    Balloo    map ref 7 house £3 office and land 19 acres
Hay   Thomas   Balloo Killinchy    Balloo    map ref 9d house £0 fifteen shillingspa and garden quarter acre1 H could this be a relative the father,son, cousin of No 7
Hayes none
Hays   Robert L.   Ballymacreelly   Killinchy   needs looking up    
Hays   Robert L.   Ballymacreelly   Killinchy  needs looking up
the maps are great!

1901 census
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Down/Killinchy/Ballymacreely/1230249/  which is No6 Hay
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Down/Killinchy/Ballymacreely/1230273/ which is No 36 Hay
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Down/Killinchy/Balloo/1230141/
which is No 2 Hay
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Down/Killinchy/Balloo/1230168/
which is No 37 Hayes
1911 census requires same treatment

1901 Genes Reunited have matches the last line entry is the treeholder for that entry here are some examples [To look up you need to be a member] perhaps you recognize someone
Robert   Hayes   1829   Saintfield, County D...    Jean   
Robert   Hayes   1800   Co. down, Northern I...    Jean   
Robert   Hayes   1795   Co Down ...          Michael   
John   Hayes   1937   DONAGHADEE County Do...    Christina   
John   Hayes   1856   Tilefish, Co Down, I...       Joseph   
John   HAYES   1856   Tilefish, Co. Down, ...       Jill   
John   Hayes   1856   Co Down,Ireland ...      Phyllis   
John   Hayes   1832   Saintfield, County D...    Jean   
John   Hayes   1832   Crevyloughan, County...    Jean   
also searching for Hay Killinchy
Elizabeth   Hayes   1837   Killinchy, DOW, IRL....Barry   
Elizabeth   HAYES   1837   Killinchy, County Do...Robyn   
Sarah   Hays   1829   Killinchy, Northern ...    Flora   
James Gourley Hayes   1827   Ballymacreely, Killi...    David   
Agnes   Hays   1827   Killinchy, Northern ...    Flora   
Robert   Hays   1823   killinchy county dow...    Flora   
James   Hays   1818   Ballymacreely killin...    Flora   
Eliza   Hayes   1814   Killinchy Co Down NI...    Molton   
Ellen   Hayes   1805   Ireland ...          Ruth

wikitree has
Elizabeth (Hayes) McClure (abt. 1836 - 1910)
Privacy Level: Open (White)
Elizabeth McClure formerly Hayes
Born about 1836 in Killinchy, County Down, Irelandmap
Daughter of [father unknown] and [mother unknown]
[sibling(s) unknown]
Wife of James McClure — married [date unknown] [location unknown]
DESCENDANTS descendants
Mother of John Hayes McClure
Died 1910 in Christchurch, Canterbury, New Zealandmap
Profile manager: Leanne Carnan private message [send private message]
This page has been accessed 29 times.

Ros Davies the Australian who has the unique Co Down website  http://www.rosdavies.com which has many surname entries searchable by Killinchy
Churches entries which give existing church records which are not all locatable at PRONI. in those entries she volunteers to look up tombstone entries. Apart from 1st Presbyterian church in Balloo check the same source for  other Presbyterian church records eg Non Subscribing Church If you can afford it give her a donation.  I use her townland maps for each civil parish a lot.  On the McClure name she has more than 10 with 2 lots going to New Zealand
I should have checked the tithes index via TheIrishgenealogy hub website
 Good luck in sharing information to find the missing links