Author Topic: Brickwall  (Read 1249 times)

Offline jonw65

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 10,856
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Brickwall
« Reply #9 on: Saturday 02 November 19 12:51 GMT (UK) »
Burial of Ann Walton
3 July 1837 at St John
Abode Stowell Street (as per William)
Age 77
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HY-6S88-DF?i=677&cc=1309819&cat=1809373

Frustratingly it looks like she may have died a day or two before the start of civil registration. At any rate there is no death reg.
Hang on, there may be an announcement in the Durham County Advertiser, 7 July 1837.


Offline jonw65

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 10,856
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Brickwall
« Reply #10 on: Saturday 02 November 19 13:00 GMT (UK) »
That one will have to wait.
Newcastle Journal, 8 July 1837
Deaths
In this town, on the 30th ult. in her 78th year, Ann, relict of the late Mr. Wm. Walton, slater.

Maybe this Ann baptized 15 April 1760 at St Andrew, father Jno Jemison :-\
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QPH6-139D

(There is of course the 1761 one as well, father William)

EDIT Another announcement in the Durham Chronicle, 7 July 1837.

Offline jonw65

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 10,856
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Brickwall
« Reply #11 on: Saturday 02 November 19 14:23 GMT (UK) »
There's a John and Elizabeth Walton in Stowell Street in the 1841 census, both age 40 (likely rounded)
Piece 848 book 1 folio 11 page 15
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:M7WN-LJN

Still there in 1851, piece 2406 folio 256 page 17. Watton on ancestry.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:SGXW-MMT

This census shows them to be siblings, rather than a married couple. Elizabeth, 61, and John, 54.
Possible baptisms?
12 June 1791, St John, Elizabeth Walton, daughter of William and Ann. Father a Smith.
26 June 1796, St John, John Walton, son of William and Ann. Father a Whitesmith.

Now is this William the smith the same man as William the slater? How likely is that?
Getting confusing, I am concerned that John the shoemaker is not going to fit in with William and Ann.

Offline jonw65

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 10,856
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Brickwall
« Reply #12 on: Saturday 02 November 19 14:34 GMT (UK) »
Death of Elizabeth?
WALTON, ELIZABETH       
Age at Death (in years): 67 
GRO Reference: 1858  S Quarter in NEWCASTLE UPON TYNE  Volume 10B  Page 42

She's a Mrs in the newspaper announcement, Newcastle Journal, 14 August 1858
Deaths
In Stowell Street, on the 11th inst. aged 67, Mrs. Elizabeth Walton.


Offline jonw65

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 10,856
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Brickwall
« Reply #13 on: Saturday 02 November 19 14:39 GMT (UK) »
I think you may need to go back to the drawing board with John Walton the shoemaker?
1841 census says born in Northumberland, but died before the 1851 census.
Marriage to Jane Robinson witnessed by Joseph Walton, Hannah Walton.
First son named Joseph.
Aged 55 on death in November 1850.

Offline jonw65

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 10,856
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Brickwall
« Reply #14 on: Saturday 02 November 19 15:23 GMT (UK) »
To confuse matters further, a butcher called John Walton was married to an Elizabeth (Richardson in 1826)
Daughter Elizabeth Richardson Walton baptized at St Nicholas, 16 Aug 1827. Abode Paradise Row, John a Butcher
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HT-6SW3-DPB?i=129&cc=1309819&cat=1821216

Mother and daughter in 1851? :-\
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:SG67-QC1

So now I am a little unsure which Elizabeth died in 1858!*
John died a widower in April 1860, there is an administration to daughter Elizabeth Richardson Walton
https://probatesearch.service.gov.uk/Calendar?surname=walton&yearOfDeath=1860&page=4#calendar

Age on death 66.
Got into a terrible tangle here! Nothing is at all certain. Is Stowell Street a coincidence?

* Sort this out, it looks quite likely that the wife Elizabeth died in 1860
Newcastle Journal, 14 Aug 1860
In Albion Street, on the 7th inst., aged 64, much respected, Mrs. Elizabeth Walton.

But John  the Butcher died "on or about 19 April 1860" - the admon was 18 August 1860, four days after the death of Elizabeth.

Offline danieloftyne

  • RootsChat Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 131
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Brickwall
« Reply #15 on: Saturday 02 November 19 22:59 GMT (UK) »
Ha ha if your confused imagine how I feel so I will try to clarify some things my great great grandfather was named william walton he was born on 16/4/1840 in jesmond vale to Jane walton nee robinson and John walton shoemaker so I looked for John and Jane's marriage they were married at St John's Church in Newcastle-upon-Tyne on 12/11/1816 with the witnesses named as hannah and Joseph walton I don't know who these are John walton shoemaker  died on 16/11/1850 at jesmond vale aged 55 Joseph his son was in attendance Jane died on 6/5/1871 aged 74 obviously I went looking for johns father and I came up with William and Ann they had 4 children Margaret born 1784,william born 1788,Elisabeth born 1791 and John born 1795/6 this william was a whitesmith but I did at some point have him down as a slater so maybe he changed his occupation who knows all these people were born in Newcastle-upon-Tyne I hope that's helped somewhat sorry to be a pain
Walton, Jones, Parker, Tipping,Nicholson, morrow,young,arrowsmith,Elliott, Anderson, ring rose, scrimshaw,hogarth,stewart

Offline jonw65

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 10,856
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Brickwall
« Reply #16 on: Sunday 03 November 19 10:02 GMT (UK) »
Hi
I do follow your line of reasoning, and it may be right. I think it's probably me being a pain! Joseph Walton as a marriage witness doesn't bother me over much, it's the subsequent naming of the first son as Joseph that makes me wonder.
Are there two baptism records for John's son Joseph?
I've mentioned the one at St Andrew on 27 Nov 1818. There is a slightly earlier one on FreeReg,
11 Nov 1818, St John
Joseph, son of John and Jane Walton
Father a Shoe maker
Abode Barracks
It notes "Baptism at the Lying-in Hospital"

EDIT
Have now found the image in the BTs
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HT-XXZ7-6V1?i=626&cc=1309819&cat=1809373

Barracks as abode throws me a bit. But looking for Joseph Waltons in Newcastle and not finding a lot in 1841, there is a burial at St Andrew, 4 Feb 1829, Joseph Walton, age 58. Abode given is just "this Parish"
BT here
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HT-67F3-J9K?i=226&cc=1309819&cat=1809360

A death announcement in the Newcastle Courant, 7 Feb 1829
On the 1st inst. at the Barracks, near this town, Mr Joseph Walton, aged 58, twenty of which he was Barrack Serjeant.

No indication as to whether he was married or not, sorry to go off on a tangent again. I would bear it mind (no more than that!)
John

FURTHER EDIT!
I don't do ancestry trees for info, but Joseph died 1829 seems to be in some. Might be able to eliminate him perhaps.

Offline danieloftyne

  • RootsChat Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 131
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Brickwall
« Reply #17 on: Sunday 03 November 19 10:49 GMT (UK) »
Hi John firstly thank you for all your help secondly these waltons have not been easy to find and are a bone of contention at times I have been doing this for about 3 years and am by no means an expert but I'm quite good at putting things together if you know what I mean this Joseph the first son is in the census of 1841 and 1851 living with John and Jane's but come 1861 he is married to someone by the name of Mary the only marriage I can find was Mary Barker from Cumberland in 1853 however when I asked for cert it stated his father's name as Joseph so it can't be him unless registrar didn't record it correctly the census isn't much help either as it records his dob wrongly as 1821 then changes to 1819 aarrrgh it drives me mad this i hate it when I can't find someone that is why I'm not a historian as I'd never get any sleep lol what I think is eerie is yesterday I was in Newcastle-upon-Tyne  city centre and for some reason I took a photo of the lying in hospital yet I have walked past it hundreds of times and not bothered weird or what that you mentioned it
Walton, Jones, Parker, Tipping,Nicholson, morrow,young,arrowsmith,Elliott, Anderson, ring rose, scrimshaw,hogarth,stewart