Author Topic: Dating for London & Berkhamstead (England) pics - maybe BUCKOKEs?  (Read 461 times)

Offline DebsR

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Dating for London & Berkhamstead (England) pics - maybe BUCKOKEs?
« on: Friday 10 January 20 19:59 GMT (UK) »
Hello all,

Please could you help date these three photos? They were in a tin along with other old photos from my paternal Great Auntie Margaret REYNOLDS (b.1904, d.2003).

I think the individual pictures of the man and woman are the same as the couple, but please say if you think differently.

The pictures are on thick card. The picture of the couple, and the woman alone were by a London photographer. The reverse is the same on both, and due to the upload limit of 4 photos, I have just included one for now. The picture of the man was by a Berkhamsted photographer; the reverse is blank.

Assuming the photos are of Margaret Reynolds’ direct ancestors (which I think is likely for various reasons), then, they could be:

-Her parents, Ernest REYNOLDS (1863-1925) and Emelin Amelia BUCKOKE (1873-1976) [I currently think this unlikely as (in my opinion) the photos we have of Emelin in later life don't look anything like the woman in these photos I'm posting]

- Daniel REYNOLDS (1817-?) and Esther Puddephatt (1822-1872) [These are Ernest REYNOLDS's parents ]

-Samuel BUCKOKE (1848-?) and Emmeline E DEASON (1850-1896) [= Emelin Amelia BUCKOKE's parents]

-another generation back from Samuel BUCKOKE and Emmeline E DEASON: i.e.  Samuel BUCKOKE (1820-1888) & Amelia NORRIS (1811-1896) or George J A DEASON (1825-1908) & Emeline HAIL (1828-?)

-or even further back on either side?

I think the BUCKOKEs and their ancestors could be our best bet as they lived in both London and Hertfordshire; however members of the other families can't be ruled out on this basis as they do both pop up in both the counties at some points.

Many thanks in advance for your help.

Debs

Offline Treetotal

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Re: Dating for London & Berkhamstead (England) pics - maybe BUCKOKEs?
« Reply #1 on: Saturday 11 January 20 12:06 GMT (UK) »
I think they are the same people and I would the date would be 1870s.
Carol
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Offline Regorian

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Re: Dating for London & Berkhamstead (England) pics - maybe BUCKOKEs?
« Reply #2 on: Saturday 11 January 20 12:19 GMT (UK) »
2nd and 3rd definitely look like 1870's.
Griffiths Llandogo, Mitcheltroy, Mon. and Whitchurch Here (Also Edwards),  18th C., Griffiths FoD 19th Century.

Offline DanNC

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Re: Dating for London & Berkhamstead (England) pics - maybe BUCKOKEs?
« Reply #3 on: Saturday 11 January 20 14:41 GMT (UK) »
The woman looks like she was photographed twice in the same session. Everything looks identical in each photo. The man looks a bit older in one photo, but the angle is almost the same, which makes comparisons easier. Everything looks very similar to me--the ears, the eyes, the nose, the hairline. I'd say it's the same man in both photos.

As far as dates, and just from having looked at a lot of my own old family photos, I'd say 1870s or 1880s. Given the date of birth of the people you mentioned, I'd say they are Samuel Buckoke and Emmeline Deason.


Offline a-l

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Re: Dating for London & Berkhamstead (England) pics - maybe BUCKOKEs?
« Reply #4 on: Saturday 11 January 20 15:20 GMT (UK) »
Definitely the same people.

Offline DebsR

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Re: Dating for London & Berkhamstead (England) pics - maybe BUCKOKEs?
« Reply #5 on: Saturday 11 January 20 16:22 GMT (UK) »
Thank you all very much all so far. It's helpful to see the photos side by side.

I'm going to work through the hypothesis that they are Samuel BUCKOKE (1848-?) and Emmeline E DEASON (1850-1896), i.e. my Great Auntie Margaret's maternal grandparents.

Any thoughts on the below would be gratefully received!

Samuel Buckoke (born North Holloway, N London) and Emmeline Deason (born Stepney, E London) were married on 29 October 1871 in Shoreditch (E / NE London); they were aged around 23 and 21 respectively and both lived in roughly that area.

Samuel was a grocer at the time (having previously worked as a shoemaker), and the son of another Samuel Buckoke, a publican. Emmeline was the daughter of George Deason; he is listed as a clerk on the marriage certificate, but seemed to have a variety of jobs through his life (seaman, policeman, gatekeeper, labourer, and eventually ended up in a workhouse).

Could the photo of the couple have been taken around the time of their wedding, as a special occasion? They both look very dressed up. But to my (untrained) eyes, they seem older than 21 and 23 in the photo. I also wonder if it would be strange for them to have ventured to South London for the photographs, when they were based North East London - where surely there would have been photographers? Any thoughts?

Alternatively, in 1887 Samuel (age 39) and Emmeline (age 36) were living briefly in New Cross (South East London), at the time of the baptism of one of their daughters. Perhaps they had photos taken on that occasion? I feel like the couple in the photo could be those ages, although would it have been more usual to include their existing young children in the picture?

Samuel and Emmeline moved to a pub in Berkhamsted (Hertfordshire) fairly soon after - by the 1891 census; where Samuel remained a publican for many years (he had already been recorded as a beer retailer at some points during their London life). Could the photo of the man alone, taken in Berkhamsted, be dated around then or is it too late (estimates so far have been 1870s, 1880s)?

Many thanks,
Debs

Offline Treetotal

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Re: Dating for London & Berkhamstead (England) pics - maybe BUCKOKEs?
« Reply #6 on: Saturday 11 January 20 17:11 GMT (UK) »
Yes it could be 1890s..I am only certain about the other two which are 1870s. Henry Crook, the photographer of the first three photos was born in 1842 in Bermuda, he is active as a photographer in London in the 1870s/80s by the 1890s he is listed as being in the workhouse.
Photographers did travel around to display there work at exhibitions.
Carol
CAPES Hull. KIRK  Leeds, Hull. JONES  Wales,  Lancashire. CARROLL Ireland, Lancashire, U.S.A. BROUGHTON Leicester, Goole, Hull BORRILL  Lincolnshire, Durham, Hull. GROOM  Wishbech, Hull. ANTHONY St. John's Nfld. BUCKNALL Lincolnshire, Hull. BUTT Harbour Grace, Newfoundland. PARSONS  Western Bay, Newfoundland. MONAGHAN  Ireland, U.S.A. PERRY Cheshire, Liverpool.
 
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