Author Topic: WHALL, Norfolk, please help me prove a link  (Read 741 times)

Offline Dulciebun

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WHALL, Norfolk, please help me prove a link
« on: Tuesday 18 February 20 19:18 GMT (UK) »
Please help me prove a link between these 2 people:
1. Ada Esther SMEED (nee WHALL), also written as Ada Smeed Whall in some documents, and later Ada E Moeran;
and
2. Christopher Whitworth WHALL 1849 - ?1924, pioneer in English stained glass.

Ada Smeed Whall was the mother of Ernest John Moeran, musical composer born in the 1890s.
Some scholars say Ada and Christopher were 'cousins', and I would dearly love them to be cousins (of any distance) ! but I can't yet find the link myself.

Ada Esther [Smeed] Whall was born in 'Lynn, Norfolk', presumably Kings Lynn, in the 1860s I think. I don't believe that the 'Smeed' was ever a married name; she was brought up by relatives (in London?), grandparents possibly, who were called Smeed.

All suggestions very welcome,
Thank you, Dulciebun
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Offline Girl Guide

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Re: WHALL, Norfolk, please help me prove a link
« Reply #1 on: Tuesday 18 February 20 20:49 GMT (UK) »
This is her birth registration from the GRO

WHALL, ADA  ESTHER SMEED    SMEED 
GRO Reference: 1866  M Quarter in KING'S LYNN  Volume 04B  Page 353

mmn Smeed
Ashford: Somerset, London
England: Devon, London, New Zealand
Holdway: Wiltshire
Hooper: Bristol, Somerset
Knowling: Devon, London
Southcott: Devon, China
Strong: Wiltshire
Watson: Cambridgeshire
White: Bristol
Windo - Gloucestershire, Somerset, Wiltshire

Offline Girl Guide

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Re: WHALL, Norfolk, please help me prove a link
« Reply #2 on: Tuesday 18 February 20 20:50 GMT (UK) »
This is Christopher's birth registration

WHALL, CHRISTOPHER  WHITWORTH     BOULTBEE 
GRO Reference: 1849  J Quarter in OUNDLE  Volume 15  Page 353
Ashford: Somerset, London
England: Devon, London, New Zealand
Holdway: Wiltshire
Hooper: Bristol, Somerset
Knowling: Devon, London
Southcott: Devon, China
Strong: Wiltshire
Watson: Cambridgeshire
White: Bristol
Windo - Gloucestershire, Somerset, Wiltshire


Offline Girl Guide

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Re: WHALL, Norfolk, please help me prove a link
« Reply #3 on: Tuesday 18 February 20 20:54 GMT (UK) »
Looks as though Ada's parents married in 1864

Marriages Dec 1864 
Smeed    Esther        Milton    2a   1321    
Whall    Benjamin John        Milton    2a   1321

I'll check the 1871 census and see where and when Benjamin was born

Research suggests that Esther is Benjamin's second wife.  I found Benjamin in the 1861 census

Registration district   Kings Lynn
Enumeration district   5
Archive reference   RG09
Piece number   1257
Folio   91
Page   19

Found a death for Julia
 
WHALL, JULIA  ANNE     26 
GRO Reference: 1863  D Quarter in KING'S LYNN  Volume 04B  Page 236
Ashford: Somerset, London
England: Devon, London, New Zealand
Holdway: Wiltshire
Hooper: Bristol, Somerset
Knowling: Devon, London
Southcott: Devon, China
Strong: Wiltshire
Watson: Cambridgeshire
White: Bristol
Windo - Gloucestershire, Somerset, Wiltshire

Offline Girl Guide

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Re: WHALL, Norfolk, please help me prove a link
« Reply #4 on: Tuesday 18 February 20 21:28 GMT (UK) »
Christopher is in the 1851 census with his parents, father is a vicar.

Registration district   Oundle
Archive reference   HO107
Piece number   1746
Folio   21
Page   34

You may find that you will have to track down all those whose surname is Whall and see if there is any connection between Christopher and Ada.  It could be further back in the family tree. It will take you some time but it is probably the only way you will know if there is any connection.
Ashford: Somerset, London
England: Devon, London, New Zealand
Holdway: Wiltshire
Hooper: Bristol, Somerset
Knowling: Devon, London
Southcott: Devon, China
Strong: Wiltshire
Watson: Cambridgeshire
White: Bristol
Windo - Gloucestershire, Somerset, Wiltshire

Offline Dulciebun

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Re: WHALL, Norfolk, please help me prove a link
« Reply #5 on: Thursday 20 February 20 11:04 GMT (UK) »
Girl Guide, thank you for your time and for the very useful details, I'm grateful.

You think that the only way to handle this is to painstakingly undertake a search, for every Whall family? wow that's an enormous task, especially since Kings Lynn and Oundle are in different counties.

Is there an economical way of doing this? What's your instinct? Should I e.g. dive in at great-grandfather level for both people, and see if I can find a common ancestor as I come forward? Or is there a different angle to take, which might bring results?

Dulciebun
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Offline jonw65

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Re: WHALL, Norfolk, please help me prove a link
« Reply #6 on: Thursday 20 February 20 11:21 GMT (UK) »
The Christopher W Whall connection is suggested in this thesis about the composer Moeran
On page 59
https://core.ac.uk/download/pdf/30276193.pdf



Offline Girl Guide

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Re: WHALL, Norfolk, please help me prove a link
« Reply #7 on: Thursday 20 February 20 11:34 GMT (UK) »
Now that is very interesting Jon, looks as though there is a connection between Ada and Christopher.  Just a case of proving it!

I think one name could be worth following down and that is Benjamin Whall 1781 to 1855.  Would need to see if there is any connection between Christopher's father William, the 1781 Benjamin and Ada's father Benjamin John.

It would be somewhere to start.
Ashford: Somerset, London
England: Devon, London, New Zealand
Holdway: Wiltshire
Hooper: Bristol, Somerset
Knowling: Devon, London
Southcott: Devon, China
Strong: Wiltshire
Watson: Cambridgeshire
White: Bristol
Windo - Gloucestershire, Somerset, Wiltshire

Offline Dulciebun

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Re: WHALL, Norfolk, please help me prove a link
« Reply #8 on: Thursday 20 February 20 11:54 GMT (UK) »
Girl Guide, Jon, thank you...

Oooh, I'm getting excited!
(Cheekily asking)... might we handle it between us? (other Roots Chatters helping out too), otherwise it's a big job for just one person with limited access to computers...

I will have a look at the Benjamin suggestion right now and try to see if there's anything obvious.
Dulciebun
Burgi (Zurich, Wintertur)
Pratt (Birmingham 1900s)