Author Topic: Harriett Carroll  (Read 2325 times)

Offline wiltshire21

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Re: Harriett Carroll
« Reply #18 on: Tuesday 25 February 20 19:22 GMT (UK) »
Unfortunately I dont have the 1909 marriage certificate yet. If her mother married ( or lived with) a Mr Carroll after her birth at the St Pancras workhouse then it is unlikely that she is the Harriett Farmer who married a Charles Carroll in Dorking in 1899 even though her daughter Rose was supposed to have been born there in 1900. I have no idea where the Hanns name comes from - it is all very confusing and the next generation is no better. Harriet's daughter Lilly married my great grandfather who was born John Stanley Wood but gives his name as Robert John Stanley Burns on his marriage certificate. He was also in and out of the workhouse during his early life but i can find no record of him between 1916 to his marriage in 1923

Online heywood

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Re: Harriett Carroll
« Reply #19 on: Tuesday 25 February 20 22:59 GMT (UK) »
Unfortunately I dont have the 1909 marriage certificate yet.

It would be interesting to see re names etc.


If her mother married ( or lived with) a Mr Carroll after her birth at the St Pancras workhouse then it is unlikely that she is the Harriett Farmer who married a Charles Carroll in Dorking in 1899 even though her daughter Rose was supposed to have been born there in 1900.

If this is young Harriet - she was born Farmer and she might have decided to use that name. Rose’s birth certificate, if that is her b Tendring might help.

I have no idea where the Hanns name comes from

The marriage certificate might show Hanns with an alias/former name but might not help at all. :-\

It is really difficult as these Carroll men appear and then disappear and whilst various certificates may provide some insight, they also are expensive. Unfortunately records of baptisms do not seem to be online for those places.
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Online jonw65

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Re: Harriett Carroll
« Reply #20 on: Wednesday 26 February 20 09:15 GMT (UK) »
Religious creed register for Pancras (two images)
Harriet Farmer, 24, admitted 12 April 1881
Birth of daughter noted next day
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3QHV-L3N2-L9BG-2?i=752&cat=1370340

Online heywood

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Re: Harriett Carroll
« Reply #21 on: Wednesday 26 February 20 10:00 GMT (UK) »
This may not apply nor be significant.
In the 1899  Charles Carroll/Harriet Farmer marriage, the celebrant was the chaplain to Dorking Workhouse. I have looked a few pages back and forth and this is the only one.
Both parties have given addresses - Charles, Church St, Dorking and Harriet, Horsham Road.


With regard to John Carroll and Harriet Farmer, there is a newspaper snippet.
May 1890 Kentish Mercury
John Edward Carrol accused of assaulting Harriet Farmer of Mill Lane.

I don’t have further access.
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Online jonw65

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Re: Harriett Carroll
« Reply #22 on: Wednesday 26 February 20 11:54 GMT (UK) »
The Dorking marriage looks good.
Sussex Agricultural Express, 9 May 1908

ADJOURNED.
Herbert Mitchell, of Catsfield, was summoned by Harriett Farmer, of 3. Lewes-cottages, Denton, to show cause, etc. The case was in respect of two children. Prosecutrix said she was married to a young man who married her under a false name. The wedding took place at Dorking, about 7 or 8 years ago. She and the defendant had been living together from 7th September, 1903, until the 21st April 1908.— The case was adjourned for a fortnight for further evidence.

More from that newspaper to come perhaps.

Online jonw65

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Re: Harriett Carroll
« Reply #23 on: Wednesday 26 February 20 12:02 GMT (UK) »
Just after the 1911 census!
Sussex Agricultural Express, 2 June 1911

Denton Neighbours Quarrel.—Mrs. Annie Ainger, of Denton, was summoned by Mrs. Harriett Savage, of Denton, for assault on the 22nd May.— Complainant stated that she resided at 12, School-cottages, Denton, and her husband was a farm labourer. The defendant lived next door to her, and on the 22nd May she went to defendant’s house to ask her to stop her child from ill-treating witness’s child. Defendant’s husband came to the door, and immediately the defendant herself came downstairs with a piece of iron bedstead in her hand, with which she hit witness on the neck. Defendant also picked up two flint stones to throw at her, but her husband took them away from her. Witness did not strike the defendant. The witness remarked "That these people are foreigners; they have only been in the village a few months and have had disturbances with three other people." Complainant denied having threatened defendant’s child.—Arthur Savage, husband of complainant, gave corroborative evidence. Defendant stated Mrs. Savage pushed by her (defendant’s) husband and slapped her round the cheek. Sarcastic remarks were made about her trying to get subscriptions to assist her to get back to India, the Government requiring £1 per head for sustenance while on board ship. She did not strike complainant as her husband kept her back. —Henry Ainger, husband, and John Andrews also gave evidence for the defendant. —The Bench dismissed the case and ordered each party to pay their own costs, 3s. each.

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Re: Harriett Carroll
« Reply #24 on: Wednesday 26 February 20 12:04 GMT (UK) »
That’s a great find and thank you Jon.
It looks as though Charles Carroll was the man using a false name.

So both mother and daughter were known as Harriet Carroll at some point. I think that would be right.

(You have added more useful information action since I began my post)  :)
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Re: Harriett Carroll
« Reply #25 on: Wednesday 26 February 20 12:15 GMT (UK) »
Wonder what Charles' real name was? Unless it was Hanns! But, yes, very well done, you were spot on with that Dorking marriage!
I've got a wild idea coming up, the notion coming after checking out that second newspaper report, from 1911. It may be horribly wrong though.
John

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Re: Harriett Carroll
« Reply #26 on: Wednesday 26 February 20 12:23 GMT (UK) »
This looks like Herbert in 1911, living with his Ransom grandparents in Catsfield parish.

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:X7BJ-BZT

There is this baptism
Herbert Mitchell 29th January 1884
Birth: 2nd October 1883
Mother: Alice
Crowhurst, Sussex


Edmond and Mary Ransom are at 1871 1037/48/3
With daughter Alice, 6yrs.
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