Murray Family Clerkenwell / Saffron Hill / Holborn

[Lynne Murray]

Family   James Murray (1855-?) married Caroline Elizabeth Dial (Dialls) Their surviving children  Thomas Murray (b 10 June 1879) and David Murray (b 1888)  David Married Susannah Stevens in 1912.
Thomas Married Annie Sewell (1897)
They had Catherine (b Dec 1899) and Thomas William (April 1912) with a thomas born earlier (1897 who died 1900 aged 2)

I have finally found Thomas Murray's death details - is as follows.  I cannot find any information on Annie Murray from 1912 to her death in 1943 in Coulsden appart from mention as widow on Thomas Military records of personal effects distribution. 

If anyone can please further assist I will be greatful.

I am happy to announced that I have found the death details of Thomas Murray born 10 June 1879 who married Annie Sewell 0n 13th June 1897. It has taken me nearly 10 years to find this info.  Thomas Murray dies on 16th January 1919 on board Gen Hosp Ship Abbassia, Egypt.  Unfortunately he died of Apendicitis after surviving WWI.  He was in the British Army a Private in 1st Garrison Btn Essex Reg Number 22105.  He was a part of the EEF (Egyption Expeditionary Force)  His effects were distributed to his Widow Annie Murray and Daughter Catherine - very interesting that his son Thomas William Murray (born 1912) was not listed??? THOUGHTS would this be because he is under 18 years (?) or does this possibly give the thought that he MAY NOT be recognised as his son (Thomas is on his birth certificate as father).  Thomas Snrs mother is noted ON MILITARY RECORDS as Mrs Elizabeth Caroline (reversed) Murray of 72 Ferndale Road South Tottenham (Correct and verified via family history and Voters Register).   I am not a full member of Ancestry.com so cant get into any further details which is a shame so therefore I cannot find when he enlisted.     Well at least now we know how and when my GG Grandad died and he can be respectfully be remembered. Now to find His father James Murray - I have a lot of his mothers details. Any help would be appreciated.

[chempat]

'His effects were distributed to his Widow Annie Murray and Daughter Catherine - very interesting that his son Thomas William Murray (born 1912) was not listed??? THOUGHTS would this be because he is under 18 years (?) or does this possibly give the thought that he MAY NOT be recognised as his son (Thomas is on his birth certificate as father).  '

Highly unlikely that it would be because he is not his son.  What was Catherine left - a small memento or something substantial?  As you said Thomas was only 6 or 7.

'I cannot find any information on Annie Murray from 1912 to her death in 1943 in Coulsden appart from mention as widow on Thomas Military records of personal effects distribution. '

What sort of records are you looking for?  If she lived where the ER's are not on-line, and never remarried, or never did something note-worthy enough to be published in a newspaper, she would maintain a low profile.

Have you tried a trial membership of Ancestry (or you might need fold3) or F M P?

'James Murray (1855-?) married Caroline Elizabeth Dial (Dialls)'

Where was he born from censuses, and who was his Father from marriage certificate?

Added:Is Caroline Elizabeth showing as Elizabeth on 1881 and 1891?

[Milliepede]

James Murray?  Saffron Hill Middlesex

1861 grandson age 5

Dennis Brian 63
Cuttie Brian 55
Johanna Brian 26
Cathern Brian 16
Ellen Murray 7
James Murray 5
Johanna Murray 1

[Milliepede]

If that is the right James he is back with parents in 1871

Michael Murray 40
Johanna Murray 39
Ellen 17
James 14
Johanna 12
Michael 2
Elizabeth Carroll 26 servant

[Milliepede]

James Murray (1855-?) married Caroline Elizabeth Dial (Dialls)

When was the marriage I can't see it?

[Lynne Murray]

Thank you - yes you have the correct family.  James Murray 22 married Elizabeth Diall on 18th Feb 1879 district of St Giles at the sardianian Church. I'm trying to trace Annie via voting records etc to see where she ended up and where she lived with my grandad in the first years of his life. My grandad is Thomas William and I know he didn't really know his dad... Now I have found he went to war that explains it. I just don't know what year Thomas snr joined up and where Annie lived from 1912.  To answer Annie (his widow received a 1/3 of his money and Daughter Catherine received the balance. Not much at all.  16pound and 32pound.

[chempat]

The marriage is to Elizabeth, no Caroline recorded?

Marriages March quarter 1879 
Elizabeth Diall     St. Giles   
James Murray     St. Giles   

Record showing on F M P

What years, as a woman, will she be eligible to show on ER's?  Also, many years are not showing online in London.

[Lynne Murray]

I have marriage cert and birth of Thomas born 1879 and Thomas born 1912.  I'm on ancestry. Com so thanks for that.  Thomas snrs father is James Murray.  Thomas Williams father is Thomas Murray. James father on marriage certificate is Michael Murray who married johanna brian/brien.  Looking again at Thomas Williams birth cert.. B1912. Its a reissue when he was 5 in 1917.

[Milliepede]

Daughter Catherine received the balance.

Who did she marry?  Just wondering if Annie was living with her in your missing years.