Author Topic: Married after "Registrars Banns"  (Read 2447 times)

Offline Rena

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 4,786
  • Crown Copyright: www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Married after "Registrars Banns"
« Reply #18 on: Tuesday 07 April 20 23:33 BST (UK) »
I have seen one Scottish baptism register entry in which the Minister said the child was born out of fornication, he did not seem happy with the situation. It did not seem to bother the child in his later life apart from the fact he appears on records sometimes with his mother's maiden name and sometimes with his  step-father's surname, and sometimes with both.

Years ago, I couldn't find a marriage record and jumped for joy when I found my ancestor's name in the national archives .....  as having "fornicated" on one particular date and married on the next day. Wat would now be called a "shotgun" wedding.
Aberdeen: Findlay-Shirras,McCarthy: MidLothian: Mason,Telford,Darling,Cruikshanks,Bennett,Sime, Bell: Lanarks:Crum, Brown, MacKenzie,Cameron, Glen, Millar; Ross: Urray:Mackenzie:  Moray: Findlay; Marshall/Marischell: Perthshire: Brown Ferguson: Wales: McCarthy, Thomas: England: Almond, Askin, Dodson, Well(es). Harrison, Maw, McCarthy, Munford, Pye, Shearing, Smith, Smythe, Speight, Strike, Wallis/Wallace, Ward, Wells;Germany: Flamme,Ehlers, Bielstein, Germer, Mohlm, Reupke

Offline Rena

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 4,786
  • Crown Copyright: www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Married after "Registrars Banns"
« Reply #19 on: Tuesday 07 April 20 23:53 BST (UK) »
None of the old fashioned words upset me, for one thing they give a clue where the words originated (which country, Norse, Germanic, etc) and set out very clearly, either what occupation or what action took place at any given point in time.

My take on this word is that its meaning is as old as the days when Jesus walked the earth and we know that meanings of words do change over time.   The King James I bible, written hundreds of years ago translated words that had originally been written in Hebrew, many centuries prior to the translation  and this is what the word meant:-

(Leviticus 18:6-20; 20:10-21). He and his descendants to the tenth generation are excluded from the assembly of the Lord.

Presumably at one time the Church of England precluded  children born out of wedlock from their congregations too. As the Parish church was the place to apply for poor relief it was one threat hanging over young people's heads that they needed to be chaste or their offspring wouldn't be able to access everything in the parish that their neighbours could access.
Aberdeen: Findlay-Shirras,McCarthy: MidLothian: Mason,Telford,Darling,Cruikshanks,Bennett,Sime, Bell: Lanarks:Crum, Brown, MacKenzie,Cameron, Glen, Millar; Ross: Urray:Mackenzie:  Moray: Findlay; Marshall/Marischell: Perthshire: Brown Ferguson: Wales: McCarthy, Thomas: England: Almond, Askin, Dodson, Well(es). Harrison, Maw, McCarthy, Munford, Pye, Shearing, Smith, Smythe, Speight, Strike, Wallis/Wallace, Ward, Wells;Germany: Flamme,Ehlers, Bielstein, Germer, Mohlm, Reupke

Offline BushInn1746

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 3,108
  • My Family's Links 19th Cent
    • View Profile
Re: Married after "Registrars Banns"
« Reply #20 on: Wednesday 08 April 20 12:11 BST (UK) »
There is no such thing as "Registrars Banns". Banns are only a Church of England ceremony, he probably means a Superintendent Registrar’s Certificate.

After 1st July 1837, Marriages in England and Wales could be by:

1)   Banns
2)   Surrogate’s or Common Licence
3)   Special Licence
4)   Superintendent Registrar’s Certificate
5)   Superintendent Registrar’s Licence

Under (1) (2) and (3) marriages may be solemnized by a Clergyman of the Established Church of England in a licensed Church or Chapel of the Church of England, or, if by Special Licence, in any place and at any time.
Under (4) they may, as in cases (1) and (2), be solemnized by a Clergyman of the Established Church of England subject to his being willing to accept the Certificate in lieu of Banns; and under (4) and (5) by or before a Registrar of Marriages in a building of Roman Catholic or other denomination duly registered by the Registrar-General; before a Registrar of Marriages and a Superintendent Registrar in the District Register Office; or after the 1898 Act .(Marriage; Nonconformist Places of Worship),  before a person duly authorised under the Act. Under this Act Roman Catholics and Nonconformists were not required to have a civil Registrar present.

Stan

Hello Stan

I hope you are well Stan and all keeping safe.

A wonderful reply, but your first sentence is misleading.

Before the new civil England & Wales Marriage Act and Amendments came into effect from 1837, the Banns were effectively a Published Notice at church of an intention to marry usually at Church.

Amendment 1 Vict., c. 22
This allowed for the Notice of the Intention to Marry also to be made at the Registrar's Office (besides church). There is a reference in 1840 to a marriage and the Act of 1 Vict., c. 22 "to substitute the Superintendent Registrar's certificate for banns" ...

Notice of a Marriage with the Registrar became known as "Registrar's Banns".

The Marriage Certificate is clearly stating who were responsible for dealing with the Notice to Marry (Church or Registry Office Banns).

Best wishes, Mark

Offline BushInn1746

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 3,108
  • My Family's Links 19th Cent
    • View Profile
Re: Married after "Registrars Banns"
« Reply #21 on: Wednesday 08 April 20 12:14 BST (UK) »
Additional attachment to above reply, Mark


Offline Lisajb

  • RootsChat Aristocrat
  • ******
  • Posts: 1,242
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Married after "Registrars Banns"
« Reply #22 on: Wednesday 08 April 20 13:00 BST (UK) »
I can still remember my husband cringing dreadfully when we went to book our wedding, on being asked for his fathers name, he had to say he didn’t know. This was in 1984.

The lady didn’t seem too bothered about that, but then he also had to admit he’d been brought up in the Catholic faith - sharp intake of breath and urgent phone call made to the church secretary
Mullingar, Westmeath Ireland: Gilligan/Wall/Meagher/Maher/Gray/O'Hara/Corroon (various spellings)
Bristol: Woodman/James/Derrick
Bristol/Somerset: Saunders/Wilmot
Gloucestershire:Woodman/Mathews/Tandy/Stinchcombe/Marten/Thompson
Wiltshire: Mathews
Carmarthen: Thomas, Lewis
Australia: Mary Lewis, transportee, married Henry Brown - what happened to her?

Offline Corryn

  • RootsChat Extra
  • **
  • Posts: 67
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Married after "Registrars Banns"
« Reply #23 on: Wednesday 08 April 20 14:17 BST (UK) »
Hi all,
I've discovered that this is a cousin marriage.
Emma was the illegitimate daughter of Alfred's mother's sister, so first cousins!! Also Emma was 6 months pregnant. Perhaps that's why they married away from their church and by Registrars Banns.

Corryn

Webb: Shropshire, Glamorgan
Cole: Shropshire, Glamorgan
Sockett/Socket: Shropshire, Herefordshire
Corbett/Corbet/Corbitt: Shropshire
Worral: Shropshire
Moss: Shropshire

Offline stanmapstone

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 25,798
    • View Profile
Re: Married after "Registrars Banns"
« Reply #24 on: Wednesday 08 April 20 14:17 BST (UK) »
"Notice of a Marriage with the Registrar became known as "Registrar's Banns".
They might have been commonly called that but legally and by the various Acts of Parliament they are not.

Banns have specific legal meaning: Proclamation or public notice given in the parish church of an intended marriage, in order that those who know of any impediment thereto may have opportunity of lodging objections.
In the Register Office the civil equivalent of Banns involves notice of the marriage being given to the superintendent registrar of the district where each party had resided for the previous seven days There is a marriage notice book where the details are entered and are available for public inspection.

Thomas Rass? apparently decided not to use the correct term, which would be married by "registrar's certificate"  as it is on all the certificates  I have seen.
Stan
 
Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline stanmapstone

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 25,798
    • View Profile
Re: Married after "Registrars Banns"
« Reply #25 on: Wednesday 08 April 20 15:43 BST (UK) »
Just to add that in over twenty years doing family history I have never before come across the term "registrar's banns"

Stan
Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline louisa maud

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 8,437
    • View Profile
Re: Married after "Registrars Banns"
« Reply #26 on: Wednesday 08 April 20 16:17 BST (UK) »
Neither have I, unnecessary  in my opinion, 

Louisa Maud
Census information is Crown Copyright,
from  www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Granath Sweden and London
Garner, Marylebone Paddington  Northolt Ilford
Garner, Devon
Garner New Zealand
Maddieson
Parkinson St Pancras,
Jenkins Marylebone Paddington
Mizon/Mison/Myson Paddington
Tindal Marylebone Paddington
Tocock, (name changed to Ellis) London
Southam Marylebone, Paddington
Bragg Lambeth 1800's
Edermaniger(Maniger) Essex Kent Canada (Toronto)
Coveney Kent Lambeth
Sondes kent and London