William WARDMAN who married in Derby in 1902

[ValJJJ]

Oops Spendlove, I just saw the last entry as been offline for a while, and did not scroll back up.  A thousand apologies.

All this info is really useful and now I see why Mabel made the link with the Otley death of William Wardman.

Still wondering why his sister had probate, not his wife???

Thanks so much for solving this puzzle that's been nagging away in the background.

Val

[ValJJJ]

Thank again to all - so pleased you could find the info that's been eluding me.

Out of interest Spendlove, where did you find the details of the marriage to Charlotte please?

Thanks.

Val

[spendlove]

Hi,

The info was from a transcript I did years ago at Derbyshire Record Office.

Is this Charlotte Ann Wardman, born 1870  leaving England 1927 for Canada on Ancestry
 in the UK and Ireland, Outward Passenger Lists, 1890-1960


Spendlove

[ValJJJ]

Good question!  I hadn't seen that entry.  Her sister emigrated to Canada and died there in 1936 so she could have visited her in 1927.  Wonder how long she stayed?  Thomas Coulson died in 1946.
 He had remarried Elizabeth someone.

I have Charlotte Ann Wardman in 1922 on the electoral roll in 11 Duchess Rd, Edgbaston, then in 10 Rotton Park Rd, Edgbaston for 1927, 4a of the same road in 1930 with her daughter, then in 1938 electoral roll, at 11 Evelyn Court, Cheltenham, and at the same address in the 1939 register but mistranscribed as Hardman. Also probate in 1944 referring to her at this address.

[Comberton]

The 1927 entry gives her address as Moat Bank, near Lichfield and she was a manageress.

[ValJJJ]

Hi Comberton

I saw that address, which is an oddity.  I looked at several passenger lists and documents related to her travelling to Canada and back again, and on her return journey her address is given as Rotten Park Rd, which is where I have her in electoral registers.  I wonder if the Moat Bank address is an error or an address of a family member?  I don't think Staffs electoral registers are online so I can't check that info at the moment.  Another thing for the end-of-virus-lockdown to-do list.

Re William Wardman, I see he is on numerous electoral registers for Otley from 1903 onwards, living in Gay Lane (the address of his family given on his marriage cert, and on census entries) as a lodger sharing a sitting room, and having sole use of a bedroom, paying rent to his mother.   I have to go through the search results more carefully now to see which years he was there.  Also to check when his father William Wardman, grocer, died.

[Mabel Bagshawe]

William Wardman who married Emily HArrison was son of Thomas Wardman, carrier

I wonder if by  1911 there were marital issues - William goes back to Otley and prefers his sister to administer his estate than his wife

Willaim the father dies in 1903 - burial 17 Nov. Address  9 Gay Lane

[ValJJJ]

Thanks Mabel.

There is a William Wardman in Gay Lane, Otley most years after 1903 so that must be the draper son, not the grocer father.

1903 (might be father or son but only one WW shown), 1904 - at 7+9 Gay Lane

1905 ?

1906 - a WW at Ash Grove, Otley. But also there in 1907 so not the right WW.

1907,8,9,10,11, 12, 13 - at 7 Gay Lane. WW is a lodger sharing use of sitting room ,sole use of one bedroom, furnished, rent to Mrs S Wardman (i.e his mother Susannah) at 7 Gay Lane, Otley.

1918 and 1919- Susannah Wardman only at 7-9 Gay Lane  Would WW been in the military during WW1? Or too old?

1920 - Susannah and William at 7-9 Gay Lane
1920 - Susannah at 6 South Parade, Otley - presumably the second half of the year

In 1922 (the year of WW's death) she was at 6 South Parade, Otley, which is the address given for WW at death, but he is not on the electoral roll for this address.

In 1925 Susannah Wardman died, address Ramsey Terrace.

Seems as if you are correct that Charlotte and William were no longer living under the same roof, but hard to tell when that happened.

[spendlove]

Hi,

Jusr to confirm are we searching for William Wardman, Draper, b. 1870 Otley son of William Wardman, Grocer, and Susannah?  Father’s details as stated on Williams marriage in 1902.

1871 Census Otley F. William, Grocer, M. Susannah
1881 “.           “
1891.  “.       St. Marylebone London
1901.  “.       Handsworth, Staffs
1911.  “.       Otley

In 1902 Derby marriage he gives his address as 75 Corporation St, Birmingham.

Do agree that there was some sort of problem with his marriage.

William Wardman Snr, died 1903 probate to Susannah Wardman £2126.15.6
William Wardman Jnr died 1922. Probate to Sarah Ellen Wardman £549 13. 11
Susannah Wardman died 1825 probate to   Lilly Jennings, wife of George Jennings £268. 14 2
Note on same page as probate for Susannah is further Grant relating to probate of
William Wardman, died 1903 of Gay Lane, to Lily Jennings  £3135.
Sarah Ellen Wardman died, 1945 probate to Elizabeth Wardman At Llandudno £280 13 7
Think Elizabeth W died Yorkshire 1946 probate Llandudno.

It would be interesting to get William W., Snr  and Jnr., Wills to see if either mentions Charlotte.  It looks as if WW Snr., will was not administered until 1925.

Spendlove