Wildsmith families in Staveley

[david1701]

Apologies in advance for the length of this post – but I need to set out a certain amount of detail. 

Basically, I obviously realise that times are strange at present, with the coronavirus lockdown – but I wonder if anyone has access to the Staveley (Derbyshire) Parish Records – or the BTs?

I ask because I’m re-visiting my problem (posted on here back in 2015), of trying to track down the baptisms of both my 6x great grandfather – Joseph Wildsmith – and his wife, Jane Norborne. They were married in Staveley on December 1st, 1713 (record available at FreeReg, but not on Familysearch, Ancestry or FindMyPast). Jane died in 1723 and Joseph re-married in 1724. His new wife was Barbara Saxton, with the marriage taking place at Chesterfield on 13th November. His marriage allegation for this second marriage – available on FindMyPast, indicates that in 1724 he was aged 34 – ie was born in 1690 or thereabouts.

Joseph had several children by both Jane and then Barbara – and a very helpful response by “spendlove” to my original post noted that the English Naming Pattern (if followed in this case), pointed to Joseph’s parents being Robert and Ann, with Jane’s parents being William and Mary.

There was, indeed, a Wildsmith family living in Staveley at the appropriate time – with parents Robert and Anne – and some 9 children, born between 1678 and 1698. But no sign of a Joseph. Mary was baptised 19th Feb 1688, with William baptised 22nd March 1691 – so there is a suitable "gap" where my Joseph could have been born/baptised – but no mention of him.

However, this brings me to the main reason for this current post. In the past I have examined microfilms of the Staveley Parish Records, at an LDS Family History Centre and the Derbyshire Records Office at Matlock – and have also examined the BTs at the old Lichfield Records Office. On none of these occasions was I able to find a baptism for Joseph or Jane – but I’m now wondering whether I might simply have overlooked them.

To explain why I’m saying this, I need to also explain that the typed transcripts of the Staveley Parish Registers which were compiled by Anthony and Sheila Smith in 2001 (which I saw at the Lichfield Records Office), and which also form the basis of the Baptism, Marriage and Burial information on the ``Staveley One Place Study” website, appear to have incorrectly recorded a baptism (illegitimate?) in 1670 of an “Alice” – where the father is recorded in the transcripts as “Robert Smith” – but where the actual Register entry seems to me to clearly read “Robert Wildsmith”. Please see attached photo.
 
I read this as saying “Alice Daughter (as said) of Robert Wildsmith & Anne Olay* bapt Oct 2”
[*or “Clay”, as the transcript says]

All of this is just to suggest that if there has been a transcription error in this case, might there also have been another error – such that I might find a baptism for Joseph Wildsmith, in the 1689-1691 period, if I’m able to check the original registers or the BTs again? I accept that this may well have to wait until the coronavirus lockdown ends – but just wondered if anyone out there – with time on their hands and access to the actual registers – might be able to assist.

Thanking you in anticipation

[CaroleW]

Is this the previous post you mention?

https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=729332.msg5740409#msg5740409

[david1701]

Indeed it is CaroleW. Thanks for your interest.

I'm no further forward with a baptism for Joseph Wildsmith (unless something comes of today's post) - but I have subsequently found a 1687 baptism of a Jane Norborne (on FreeReg) at Harthill in West Yorkshire (not that many miles from Staveley). This sounds about the right time - but Jane's father is recorded as Godfrey - so not in accordance with the naming convention mentioned in spendlove's post.

So this might be the baptism of my 6x great grandmother - but at present, there's no real way of knowing.

Thanks again for your interest - any thoughts and/or suggestions you may have will be gratefully received.

[Designer Jeans]

Do you have Joseph's will?  It is possible it might hold clues https://www.staffsnameindexes.org.uk/default.aspx?Index=C&LastName=wildsmith&Part=0&YearFrom=1610&YearTo=1780&Place=&County=3&Gender=0&Occupation= 

[david1701]

Hi Designer Jeans,

Many thanks for your comment.

Yes, I have seen Joseph's will - it makes a good read, and it has given me some useful information - not least the confirmation that he had a son named Robert - who I had always thought was my 5x great grandfather, and I took Joseph's will as confirmation of this fact.

The will has, however, proved to be unhelpful - at least so far - in providing any information which might help in establishing who Joseph's parents were.

That said, the will has thrown up a puzzle I haven't yet solved. Just who was Joseph's "Daughter in Law Anne Otley", to whom he left One Guinea? I think his own daughter Anne married a Joseph Cam in April 1747 at St George, Mayfair - and strictly speaking, any daughter in law should have married one of Joseph's sons - and hence had the surname Wildsmith. Unless, I suppose (thinking out loud here), perhaps this Anne did marry a Wildsmith - was then widowed - and subsequently married an Otley. I sense a new line of research brewing!  Unless anyone else can furnish an answer to this puzzle?

[david1701]

Ah - I've just had a further thought. When Joseph married his second wife - Barbara - in 1724, she was a widow.  I've never tried to check out her first marriage - but I suppose this "Anne Otley" could be one of Barbara's children by her first marriage - and regarded as a "daughter in law" by Joseph. Again, new research beckons!

[Designer Jeans]

What a tricky family with a lot of loose ends.  If this is correct the Staveley PRs have not survived -Derbyshire Record Office reference D 661 has deposited parish registers Bap 1558-1665, 1702-1978 Marr 1558-1665, 1702-1988 Bur 1558-1692, 1702-1991 Banns 1754-1813, 1940-1999 https://www.familysearch.org/wiki/en/Staveley,_Derbyshire_Genealogy so the only record available are the BTs which you have already checked?  Any additional info on the Joseph/Barbara marriage licence?  Ancestry seems to indicate that the marriage licence was recorded in the Chesterfield PR, but that the marriage took place at Heath.  I think in-law is quite a loose term to record a relationship of some kind and was certainly used for step children.  It wouldn't hurt to investigate Barbara fully (birth, marriage, children, death of husband/did he leave a will, etc) and the same for Ann Otley. 

[Designer Jeans]

Snippet here Staveley "99* John SAXTON sojourner at Joseph WILDSMITH? of Woodthorp to John SMITH of Eastwood Notts. 1732"  http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~spire/Yesterday/index.htm  Probably too late to be of help, but free at the moment is Abstract of Will of John Wildsmith, Farmer of South Wingfield, Derbyshire. Proved in the Court of Lichfield.  https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/D7184196 

[david1701]

Hi again Designer Jeans – and thanks once more for your interest in this matter.

As you may have realised by the fact that my last post on Rootschat was back in 2016 – I do my family history research in fits and starts – and am just renewing my interest after a lengthy lay-off!

In the past – in 2015 – I visited the old Lichfield Records Office and was able to see and photograph a whole load of  Wildsmith wills – including Joseph (Staveley 1766), Robert (Duffield 1804) and John (Sth Wingfield 1809). All have been very helpful (and all are now available on FindMyPast!) – but they haven’t helped me to crack the knotty problem of who Joseph’s parents were! Nor, indeed, have I made any meaningful progress on establishing who Jane Norborne’s parents were – although I did also photograph some Norborne wills back in 2015 – but no useful info leapt out at me.

Regarding the BTs – yes, I did look though them at Lichfield  (and photographed some entries), and found a variety of Wildsmith baptisms – but drew a blank regarding a baptism of Joseph around 1690. As I’d said back in my 2016 post - https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=755150.0 - I wondered at the time whether the baptism of John in 1694 may have been wrongly transcribed from the original Registers – but I think I was possibly just grasping at straws.

It was the finding of the error regarding the transcription of “Alice, daughter of Robert Wildsmith….” – referred to in my first post in this thread – that got me thinking again about the BTs. Back in 2015 I didn’t photograph all the entries for 1689-1691 – and I don’t think the images are currently available anywhere on the net. I’m just hoping that as and when I can see them again – perhaps with fresh eyes – a possible baptism for Joseph leaps out at me!

Thanks for the “Yesterdays Journey” snippet about John Saxton. I had seen it before, but have not taken it any further. My immediate reaction is that this John was quite likely another of Barbara Saxton’s children from her first marriage – but again I’ve drawn a blank trying to track down any details of this first marriage.

That said, following your post I’ve quickly checked Familysearch, and have located a baptism of a John Saxton at Staveley in November 1719, father John Saxton and mother Barbara! Sounds as though I hadn’t been checking very hard in the past!

I’ll keep on looking – but as I said before, if anyone out there has any thoughts or suggestions as to how I might pursue this quest, I’d be more than happy to hear from you.