Author Topic: Ure Beatrice Ward, left Australia 1922 for London  (Read 3715 times)

Offline sugarfizzle

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Re: Ure Beatrice Ward, left Australia 1922 for London
« Reply #72 on: Wednesday 27 May 20 10:23 BST (UK) »
I have family members in the Bundaberg  region in Queensland.  Best Hinkler, famous Australian Aviator came from there.  His bio at the online Australian Dictionary of Biography gives  info out a connection with  Canada during his WWI years.  Bert Hinkler is mentioned in the newspaper writeup about Edward Steven   :)  it could be that may help explain how Edward sourced a valid  place name for his birth place on his WWII records.

JM

Bob has a telegram sent to his grandfather from (Bert) Hinckler/Hinkler as previously mentioned.

There is so much that Edward Steven /Alfred Ward made up, it is difficult to sort fact from fiction!!

Margaret
STEER, mainly Surrey, Kent; PINNOCKS/HAINES, Gosport, Hants; BARKER, mainly Broadwater, Sussex; Gosport, Hampshire; LAVERSUCH, Micheldever, Hampshire; WESTALL, London, Reading, Berks; HYDE, Croydon, Surrey; BRIGDEN, Hadlow, Kent and London; TUTHILL/STEPHENS, London
WILKINSON, Leeds, Yorkshire and Liverpool; WILLIAMSON, Liverpool; BEARE, Yeovil, Somerset; ALLEN, Kent and London; GORST, Liverpool; HOYLE, mainly Leeds, Yorkshire

Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.go

Offline sparrett

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Re: Ure Beatrice Ward, left Australia 1922 for London
« Reply #73 on: Wednesday 27 May 20 12:29 BST (UK) »
Just an observation here.

Edward/Alfred WARD is listed as a traveller on his arrival in 1922.
We would today call that a travelling salesman.

Electoral rolls show him as a salesman and at one stage he is a guest-house proprietor.

On his arrival in Melbourne which is listed with Ure and Steven, he would have needed employment promptly. To support this he would need a female partner to care for the child. As Ure was in England (and, in my opinion, never left) there was obviously somebody filling this role.   The family of Perfrement was based in Armidale and Tamworth area.  I do not believe it was her.

 
Sue

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Offline sugarfizzle

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Re: Ure Beatrice Ward, left Australia 1922 for London
« Reply #74 on: Wednesday 27 May 20 12:54 BST (UK) »
Quote
She married again in 1917 as a widow her first husband arrived back the following year. I have been told that she was informed that he was missing, presumed dead, whereas in fact he was a POW

I didn't see anything in Alfred's navy records to suggest that he had been posted missing or taken prisoner in 1917 or earlier. His RAF record shows that he was taken prisoner by the Turks in July 1918 but that was nearly a year after his wife's bigamous marriage to Ernest Hubbard.

As you say, Shaun. I think he may have split up with Ure prior to going to war, gave his sister as next of kin.

They both married bigamously, Ure unwilling to marry for a third time, that might have been a bit much, even for her!!

Regards Margaret
STEER, mainly Surrey, Kent; PINNOCKS/HAINES, Gosport, Hants; BARKER, mainly Broadwater, Sussex; Gosport, Hampshire; LAVERSUCH, Micheldever, Hampshire; WESTALL, London, Reading, Berks; HYDE, Croydon, Surrey; BRIGDEN, Hadlow, Kent and London; TUTHILL/STEPHENS, London
WILKINSON, Leeds, Yorkshire and Liverpool; WILLIAMSON, Liverpool; BEARE, Yeovil, Somerset; ALLEN, Kent and London; GORST, Liverpool; HOYLE, mainly Leeds, Yorkshire

Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.go


Offline matthewj64

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Re: Ure Beatrice Ward, left Australia 1922 for London
« Reply #75 on: Wednesday 27 May 20 13:01 BST (UK) »
From Ancestry, UK, Absent Voter Lists, 1918-1925, 1939
'The Absent Voter Lists enabled servicemen and women to vote by proxy or by postal application, when away from home on active service. They record the civilian address of the absent voter...'

1918 & 1919, Alfred Ward - 69 Killyon Rd, Wandsworth, Sgt RAF, Service No.203593

Offline sugarfizzle

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Re: Ure Beatrice Ward, left Australia 1922 for London
« Reply #76 on: Wednesday 27 May 20 15:08 BST (UK) »
Sue, You may well be right that Ure didn't leave England, all the evidence appears to point that way. I have emailed Bob, asked him if his grandfather told him that she came to Australia (likely to be true), if his father told him ( less likely but still a possibility), or whether it was inferred from the shipping records (least likely to be correct)

matthewj64, Another good find, I've never used those records before, might find something else of interest there!!

Regards Margaret
STEER, mainly Surrey, Kent; PINNOCKS/HAINES, Gosport, Hants; BARKER, mainly Broadwater, Sussex; Gosport, Hampshire; LAVERSUCH, Micheldever, Hampshire; WESTALL, London, Reading, Berks; HYDE, Croydon, Surrey; BRIGDEN, Hadlow, Kent and London; TUTHILL/STEPHENS, London
WILKINSON, Leeds, Yorkshire and Liverpool; WILLIAMSON, Liverpool; BEARE, Yeovil, Somerset; ALLEN, Kent and London; GORST, Liverpool; HOYLE, mainly Leeds, Yorkshire

Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.go

Offline wivenhoe

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Re: Ure Beatrice Ward, left Australia 1922 for London
« Reply #77 on: Thursday 28 May 20 00:13 BST (UK) »
NSW BDM marriage
11494/1945 WARD Steven Claude    marr.   BEEHAG Hilda Eileen   @ Rockdale

What details does Steven give for himself and both his parents.

This is important information. Can you please find out what details Steven gives for himself and both his parents. Ask Bob for this information. If Bob does not have the marriage record, he needs to get it.

WW1 service file for Alfred WARD........is it from a subscription service or free to access....ie am I able to locate and see this file?

Police service record.....is there an accessible online source to see this?

Offline sparrett

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Re: Ure Beatrice Ward, left Australia 1922 for London
« Reply #78 on: Thursday 28 May 20 00:53 BST (UK) »
Just wondering also, was there any comment or anything familiar to your people about the address

22 Yonge Park, Finsbury Park, N4

As given in a previous post as being the last UK address of Alfred and Ure shown on their arrival entry to Aust.

Sue
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Offline majm

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Re: Ure Beatrice Ward, left Australia 1922 for London
« Reply #79 on: Thursday 28 May 20 01:11 BST (UK) »
Remembering that the service number for rank and file in the UK military in WWI was NOT a unique number, but that 203593 was one number allocated to Alfred WARD and also possibly to others ....

So I have used some 'outside the square' online searchings ... and my NSW State Library eresources ... and I have searched for '203593' ...
Gloucester Journal, Saturday May 12, 1917 Volume CXCVI,  Issue 10154, p. 6 Article.
The British Casualties.
The Gloucesters' Losses.
.....  (many .... paragraphs  :'( of names of the fallen and the wounded)
Thursday night's casualty lists contained the names of 217 officers (48 dead) and 4,308 rank and file (1,293 dead).  The latter included the following:- Died of wounds : Gloucester Regt., 203593 J. Apperley, Hereford. ....

So it is possible that Alfred's sister was given unofficial information about the Gloucester soldier's death as though it was Alfred rather than J Apperley.

JM

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Offline majm

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Re: Ure Beatrice Ward, left Australia 1922 for London
« Reply #80 on: Thursday 28 May 20 03:51 BST (UK) »
I have family members in the Bundaberg  region in Queensland.  Best Hinkler, famous Australian Aviator came from there.  His bio at the online Australian Dictionary of Biography gives  info out a connection with  Canada during his WWI years.  Bert Hinkler is mentioned in the newspaper writeup about Edward Steven   :)  it could be that may help explain how Edward sourced a valid  place name for his birth place on his WWII records.


JM

http://adb.anu.edu.au/biography/hinkler-herbert-john-bert-6680

This biography mentions Bert Hinklerís WWI service with the RNAS and the Canadian Pilot in the No. 5 Squadron as Charles B SPROATT who gave him his first chance to fly a plane.    It also gives Bert Hinkler as completing an aerial gunlayers course in 1916, and being in the No. 3 Wing escorting RNAS bombers from  Luxeuil and Ochey near Nancy, France. 
 I Confirm that
 ADM188 piece 567 for Alfred WARD, F3593, shows that he was Aero Wing No. 3 Luxeuil 29/11/16 Ö.. and notes include reference to the ship President II.  (See my ADD below) 
ADM188 piece 560 is for Bert Hinkler, F311, and notes Wing 3, France from 1 April 1915 until 1917 and notes include reference to the ship President II (See my ADD below)
So that places Bert Hinkler and Alfred Ward together, and Bert Hinkler and the Canadian Pilot together.   

The Canadian Pilot is likely to have been Charles Beverley SPROATT, who was born in Ontario, Canada, and who was awarded the Distinguished Service Cross see his various mentions in the London Gazette. 
Issue 29573 page 4551 of 9 May 1916
Issue 30324 page 10296 of 5 October 1917
Supplement 30363 pages 11320 and 11321 of 30 October 1917 **
Issue 30876 page 10189 of 30 August 1918
Issue 31271, page 4422 of 4 April 1919

** Flt Sub-Lieut. Charles Beverley Sproatt, R.N.A.S. carried out a bombing attack on Bruges Docks on the 4th September 1917 obtaining direct hits.  He was subjected to heavy and accurate anti-aircraft fire and his machine was shot about and radiator pierced.

ADD ... the President II was the shore establishment (stone frigate) near the Tower Bridge in London.   :D  thanks to one of my ancient living rellies reading my post and phoning me 'straight away' to remind me that HMS President II was a stone frigate.   ::)

 JM
The information in my posts is provided for academic and non-commercial research purposes. 
Random Acts of Kindness Given Freely are never Worthless for they are Priceless.
Qui scit et non docet.    Qui docet et non vivit.    Qui nescit et non interrogat.   
All Census Look Ups Are Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
I do not have a face book or a twitter account.