Author Topic: Gilling, North Yorkshire  (Read 1829 times)

Offline zalib

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Re: Gilling, North Yorkshire
« Reply #45 on: Monday 27 July 20 04:57 BST (UK) »
Regarding the GIBSON ladies: We have Dorothy who married William LASCELLES whose descendant became vicar of Gilling. I'm struggling to understand how many generations fit between William and the vicar, two or three.
Dorothy's sister Frances first married Joseph HALL, whose grandson John married Anne STEVENSON and he took the name HALL-STEVENSON. Frances secondly married John STEVENSON, a descendant of the MANNERS line, and his grand-daughter was the Anne STEVENSON who married John HALL. Anne's mother was not Frances, so the gene pool was not compromised!
The MANNERS line can be traced back to Lincolnshire and includes a marriage to a MILDMAY of Essex. It also includes a couple of links to the WHARTON name, Anne STEVENSON's father, Ambrose, married an Anne WHARTON.
The John HALL I'm interested in doesn't seem to be in any of the trees I've seen now that I know he is not the son of General Thomas HALL (1725-1809).
There were a number of HALL families in Rutland and Lincolnshire, including a Thomas HALL who married a MILDMAY at Kettleworth, Lincs, but they do not match the people in the Skelton HALL families so I'm still wondering what was in that document that the Rev Francis POYNTON had regarding the Rutland families.
Joseph HALL who married Elizabeth TROTTER is the right age to be my John HALL's grandfather, and his sons, including Thomas were great candidates for father. I'm still looking at George as a possibility, but if not him then I go back to the story that Joseph HALL was the only son of Frances who survived, so I'd then have to go back more generations to find a more distant cousin who was appointed as curate at Gilling.
Pembrokeshire - Brown, Rees, Thomas, James, Nedahl, Noot
Somerset - Brown, Parfitt, Daniell, Wheeler, Clissold, Indoe
Wiltshire - Collins

Offline Geordie Mag

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Re: Gilling, North Yorkshire
« Reply #46 on: Monday 27 July 20 20:41 BST (UK) »
There are some other Halls in Durham, rich coal owners and Aldermen of the city and one of them, Anthony, mentions his nephew ?Robert? Wharton. (Sorry, I've forgotten and can't find my note.)However, I have not managed to make a link between the 2 lots of Halls, while the Whartons may well be a completely different family as they seem to have been drapers, though very wealthy and influential in Durham. I shall do more research. Mag
Northumberland: Little, Hogg, Tyers, Reid
Durham: Todd, Lee,
Cumbria: Ross, Ivison, Tyers
Yorkshire North Riding: Pybus, Alderson, Rutherford, Mudd, Wilson
Sussex: Selmes, Ashdown, Freelove, Mitchell

Offline Geordie Mag

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Re: Gilling, North Yorkshire
« Reply #47 on: Tuesday 28 July 20 21:05 BST (UK) »
Surtees "History of Durham" 1823, vol 3, says of the Durham Whartons "A very respectable branch of the family was established at Gillingwood in Yorkshire but the main stem of Dr Wharton's (ie the Durham  Whartons of his day) was seated at Kirkbythore in Westmoreland, being in all probability a branch of the Wharton of Wharton, Westmoreland.
Thomas Wharton married Mary Hall, daughter of Alderman John Hall of Durham and by the time of her death in 1700 they had had George, Robert, Thomas (went to Virginia)jane and Mary, plus several children who died when small.
Mary's brothers were Anthony, Thomas and Jonathan aaaaHall.Anthony married but I haven't found any children as yet. Jonathan became a very wealthy prebendary of the Cathedral, but didn't marry Thomas died young but had a son Anthony who in turn had at least 2 children, Jonathan and Anthony. That family lied at Wombwell near Barnsley (oarish Darfield I think). No John Hall as yet except of course for Alderman John Hall who died in 1703. There was a John Hall mayor of Durham in the 1650s, presumably the same family. John Hall and Joseph Hall died within a year of each other. Could they have been brothers?

Northumberland: Little, Hogg, Tyers, Reid
Durham: Todd, Lee,
Cumbria: Ross, Ivison, Tyers
Yorkshire North Riding: Pybus, Alderson, Rutherford, Mudd, Wilson
Sussex: Selmes, Ashdown, Freelove, Mitchell


Offline zalib

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Re: Gilling, North Yorkshire
« Reply #48 on: Thursday 30 July 20 03:41 BST (UK) »
A few quick thoughts - the HALLs of Durham may have been related to the HALLs of  the Egglescliffe area (sometimes Egsclife). Britsh History Online for Egglescliffe has a tree for HALLs of Newsham. The tree covers 1500s to end of 1600s so doesn't quite provide the link I need. It does say that this branch was originally from Gretford/Greatford, Lincs. There's also the following "In 1684 the freeholders in Egglescliffe were, John Trotter, of Skelton, Esq. in Yorkshire; John Hall, Alderman of Durham" and also "Edward Trotter, Esq." who is presumably the one who married Mary LOWTHER, father of Catherine who married Joseph HALL.
There was (I think!) a William HALL, mayor, the BHO article mentions: William Hall, of London, goldsmith, 16 Feb. 1660 who gave a charitable donation in Egglescliffe.
A general history of the name HALL says that the original family were given land in Lincs. and spread from there, so I'm cautious in case the link back there is wishful thinking by later generations seeking connections, but Lincolnshire does keep coming up!
Pembrokeshire - Brown, Rees, Thomas, James, Nedahl, Noot
Somerset - Brown, Parfitt, Daniell, Wheeler, Clissold, Indoe
Wiltshire - Collins

Offline Geordie Mag

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Re: Gilling, North Yorkshire
« Reply #49 on: Thursday 30 July 20 20:48 BST (UK) »
Yes, I was looking at this tree and noticed the mention of Lincolns but it stops too soon. I've been collecting references to Alderman John Hall, who died 1703, obviously the sort of man you got to be trustee of your charity - like your John Hall, come to think of it. But very few records of key info like his age. Still looking - been out all day so not much time. I'll let you know if I find anything significant. Mag
Northumberland: Little, Hogg, Tyers, Reid
Durham: Todd, Lee,
Cumbria: Ross, Ivison, Tyers
Yorkshire North Riding: Pybus, Alderson, Rutherford, Mudd, Wilson
Sussex: Selmes, Ashdown, Freelove, Mitchell

Offline Geordie Mag

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Re: Gilling, North Yorkshire
« Reply #50 on: Friday 31 July 20 20:43 BST (UK) »
Have been looking at Charles Hall, one  of Greencroft Halls. They were based near Lanchester, a few miles from Durham, but Charles moved to Durham as a draper. He marries isabel Conyers in 1610. She grew up in East Durham, but the Conyers family did have land by the Tees, so she could have brought land in Egglescliffe as her settlement, possibly. They had several children including a son John, born 1622 in Durham. Interestingly, the Stevensons were living nearby at Byerside in Medomsley parish. Sadly, wills of that period can't be viewed on the inheritance database - too fragile.
Northumberland: Little, Hogg, Tyers, Reid
Durham: Todd, Lee,
Cumbria: Ross, Ivison, Tyers
Yorkshire North Riding: Pybus, Alderson, Rutherford, Mudd, Wilson
Sussex: Selmes, Ashdown, Freelove, Mitchell

Offline Geordie Mag

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Re: Gilling, North Yorkshire
« Reply #51 on: Friday 31 July 20 20:52 BST (UK) »
Bingo. Have realised that under Byerside there is also a tree for Hall of Byerside. John Hall, clergyman originally from Lincolnshire (yes, indeed!) had a son Joseph died 1701 and a son John Hall, still living 1701, and then it feeds into the Hall-Stevenson tree you know.
Northumberland: Little, Hogg, Tyers, Reid
Durham: Todd, Lee,
Cumbria: Ross, Ivison, Tyers
Yorkshire North Riding: Pybus, Alderson, Rutherford, Mudd, Wilson
Sussex: Selmes, Ashdown, Freelove, Mitchell

Offline zalib

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Re: Gilling, North Yorkshire
« Reply #52 on: Saturday 01 August 20 05:00 BST (UK) »
Unfortunately, the more I look the more it gets complicated. The CHAL(L)ONER families are implicated, along with the LASCELLES, TROTTER, LAWSON and GIBSON, intermarrying and associating with each other more than once. A CHALONER is on a church memorial along with a TROTTER, I think I saw a HALL, LASCELLES and CHALONER together in another article about the HALL's quarry.

They all cross each others path in Durham, Lancaster (HALL-STEVENSON property?), Egglescliffe, Elwick, Guisborough (Skelton Castle included). Some are also found in York. Properties were passed to brother Thomas HALL (General) by HALL-STEVENSON, so Stotfold and Elwick are mentioned in his will.

There are two trees mentioning Lincolnshire, the Byerside tree started my search there and inspired my search for MILDMAY connections assuming that HANNAH MORE was right about John HALL's ancestry. There are mistakes though: Lawson TROTTER is shown as 'died unmarried' but I have him marrying Dorothy LOWTHER and they produced a dau. Elizabeth. George Lawson HALL, a colonel in the army had, I presume, an illegitimate child the year after his wife died, as there's a birth for 'George Lawson HALL or KETTLEWELL' in 1761, and several more generations of people withe the same name.

The Durham archives provides many references to these people and British History Online helps. The 'History of Mount Grace' book has the LASCELLES tree.
Pembrokeshire - Brown, Rees, Thomas, James, Nedahl, Noot
Somerset - Brown, Parfitt, Daniell, Wheeler, Clissold, Indoe
Wiltshire - Collins

Offline zalib

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Re: Gilling, North Yorkshire
« Reply #53 on: Tuesday 04 August 20 06:08 BST (UK) »
I've been looking at the LOWTHER connections relating to the 'Mrs PEARSE' who gave Theophilus LINDSEY the right to Chew Magna after a meeting in 1751. They were staying at Longleat with the Duchess of Somerset. Mrs PEARSE was Mary LOWTHER (d1756), a cousin of Sir Henry LOWTHER, 3rd Viscount Lonsdale. She married James PEARSE (d 1751) a lawyer.
The Duchess of Somerset was Frances THYNNE, and her great Aunt married John LOWTHER (1655-1700). John LOWTHER's sister Mary married Edward TROTTER. John LOWTHER was the grandson of John LOWTHER (1606-1675) and a cousin (same grandfather, different grandmothers) of Ralph LOWTHER. Ralph's daughter Dorothy married Lawson TROTTER, the grandson of Edward TROTTER. This John LOWTHER's father had a brother Robert LOWTHER (1595-1655) whose granddaughter was Mary LOWTHER who married James PEARSE.
I was trying to draw a diagram but can only do it properly in 3 dimensions because of the tangled relationships.
Suffice to say that Mary PEARSE might have known the TROTTERs and maybe the HALLs but Theophilus LINDSEY did not marry Hannah ELSWORTH until 4 years after Mrs PEARSE had died so her familiarity with the BLACKBURNE family is unknown.
Pembrokeshire - Brown, Rees, Thomas, James, Nedahl, Noot
Somerset - Brown, Parfitt, Daniell, Wheeler, Clissold, Indoe
Wiltshire - Collins