Author Topic: WILLIAMS Edna Salford /Manchester -Birth/Death/Parents/Census  (Read 1250 times)

Offline margaret1

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Re: WILLIAMS Edna Salford /Manchester -Birth/Death/Parents/Census
« Reply #27 on: Sunday 12 July 20 05:44 BST (UK) »
I wonder if this could be Edna's death - birth year 1 year out but not uncommon on death registrations
1973
Name:   Edna Williams
Death Age:   57
Birth Date:   20 Feb 1916
Registration Quarter:   Apr-May-Jun
Registration district:   Manchester
Inferred County:   Lancashire
Volume:   10e
Page:   589

This could be she - thanks for that lancsann also I'll see what else I can find out about the Bertha and her sisters from Liverpool - it all helps! 8)
margaret
All Census Lookups are Crown Copyright, National Archives for academic and non-commercial research purposes only

ARCHIBALD/ADAMS/BROWN/GORDON/WILSON/Midlothian
CADDY/COPPIN/GEDYE/GIDDEY/GIDDY/GROWDEN/KITT/OLIVER/THOMAS/Cornwall
CAREY/France/Kent/NZ 
CARMICHAEL/GRAHAM/CRAMB/STEWART/Perth
CLOUGH/Lancs/Yorks/NSW
CORNWELL/Kent/NSW 
EATON/Lon/NSW    
MALYON/Mdx  
MATTHEWS/Lon/Sry/Oxf/Glouc/NSW
McLEOD/THOMSON/E Lothian
QUINN/Kilkenny
TUCK/HART/Mdx/Esx
VICCARS/ Lond/Northamps/Hunts
WATSON/Down

Offline margaret1

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Re: WILLIAMS Edna Salford /Manchester -Birth/Death/Parents/Census
« Reply #28 on: Thursday 06 August 20 07:55 BST (UK) »
I'm back with an update.

Firstly, Bertha Williams and her sisters, Annie and Edith were the children of John Williams and Mary Jane mn Smith.

FreeBMD Marriages Dec 1873   
Williams  John and Smith Mary Jane Liverpool    8b   356    

They had 7 children - John, William F,  Edith G,  Florence L,  Bertha, Annie and Herbert, found in various censuses living in Liverpool. 

I'm unable to link this family to my husband's at this time but will file away  the information I have collected just in case I find a link further down the track.

Next I searched FreeBMD Lancashire to see if I could find more possible births for Edna Williams - it seems the only ones I could find all married in 1938/1939 therefore not likely to be our Edna:

Births Jan/Feb/Mar 1915 Lancashire

WILLIAMS    Edna M   mmn  Wren    W. Derby    8b   1172      
WILLIAMS    Edna M    mmn Edwards    W. Derby    8b   1300

Marriages Sep 1938 - Williams  Edna M       Alexander Harold  Liverpool N. 8b   1264

Marriages Sep 1939  - Williams  Edna M         Todd George V    Liverpool N.    8b  1327

Births Jan/Feb/Mar 1915 Lancashire

WILLIAMS    Edna N    mmn Tregideon W. Derby    8b   450
Marriages Jun 1939 -  Williams    Edna N         Roberts William G    Crosby    8b   1262

England & Wales, Civil Registration Death Index, 1916-2007
Edna Nora Roberts
Birth   04/01/1915 Liverpool Lancashire England
Death   31/03/1985 Liverpool Lancashire England
Death Age:   70
Registration Date:   31/3/1985
Registration district:   Liverpool
Volume:   36
Page:   425
Father   Francis Arthur Williams (1887-1956)
Mother  Norah Tregidion (1886-1936)
Spouse   William George Roberts (1911-1986)
All Census Lookups are Crown Copyright, National Archives for academic and non-commercial research purposes only

ARCHIBALD/ADAMS/BROWN/GORDON/WILSON/Midlothian
CADDY/COPPIN/GEDYE/GIDDEY/GIDDY/GROWDEN/KITT/OLIVER/THOMAS/Cornwall
CAREY/France/Kent/NZ 
CARMICHAEL/GRAHAM/CRAMB/STEWART/Perth
CLOUGH/Lancs/Yorks/NSW
CORNWELL/Kent/NSW 
EATON/Lon/NSW    
MALYON/Mdx  
MATTHEWS/Lon/Sry/Oxf/Glouc/NSW
McLEOD/THOMSON/E Lothian
QUINN/Kilkenny
TUCK/HART/Mdx/Esx
VICCARS/ Lond/Northamps/Hunts
WATSON/Down

Offline margaret1

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Re: WILLIAMS Edna Salford /Manchester -Birth/Death/Parents/Census
« Reply #29 on: Thursday 06 August 20 07:55 BST (UK) »
9 Piercy Street Failsworth has proven to be a permanent address for Hugh T and Lydia Williams, residing there from 1922 - 1930 from England & Wales - Electoral Registers 1920-1932 - FindMyPast and in 1929 Hugh is listed in UK, City and County Directories, 1766 - 1946 - Ancestry.co.uk with same adddress and occupation (fireman) and of course they are still living there in 1939.
Possible deaths for HughT in 1944 and 1945 FreeBMD
Deaths Sep 1944
Williams   Hugh T   72   Warrington   8c   109
Deaths Jun 1945
Williams   Hugh T   72   Ashton   8d   604
and Lydia
Deaths Jun 1966  FreeBMD
WILLIAMS    LYDIA    87    LIVERPOOL N    10D   302
All Census Lookups are Crown Copyright, National Archives for academic and non-commercial research purposes only

ARCHIBALD/ADAMS/BROWN/GORDON/WILSON/Midlothian
CADDY/COPPIN/GEDYE/GIDDEY/GIDDY/GROWDEN/KITT/OLIVER/THOMAS/Cornwall
CAREY/France/Kent/NZ 
CARMICHAEL/GRAHAM/CRAMB/STEWART/Perth
CLOUGH/Lancs/Yorks/NSW
CORNWELL/Kent/NSW 
EATON/Lon/NSW    
MALYON/Mdx  
MATTHEWS/Lon/Sry/Oxf/Glouc/NSW
McLEOD/THOMSON/E Lothian
QUINN/Kilkenny
TUCK/HART/Mdx/Esx
VICCARS/ Lond/Northamps/Hunts
WATSON/Down


Offline margaret1

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Re: WILLIAMS Edna Salford /Manchester -Birth/Death/Parents/Census
« Reply #30 on: Thursday 06 August 20 08:00 BST (UK) »
It looks like I'll have to be patient and wait for the 1921 Census online to be published in January 2022 to hopefully see where 6 year old  Edna is living and with whom. In the meantime I would like to follow up on the possibility that Edna may have been adopted/fostered by Hugh T and Lydia and  who may have changed her birth surname to Williams.

A great percentage of husband, David's DNA matches have the name Cain/Caine from the Isle of Man and some from Liverpool. Now this is a very long shot and I may be clutching at straws but I searched for birth/baptisms with the surname Cain(e) and found these results:
FreeBMD Births Jan/Feb/Mar 1915 Lancashire

Cain   Edna   mmn Cain   Toxteth P.      8b   430

I also searched ManxBMD.com using both Cain/Caine. with and without forename and forename only without success. 

However on FindMyPast Lancashire Baptisms I found an Edna Caine with our Edna'a exact birth date!

Lancashire Baptisms Aigburth, St Anne, Church of England Liverpool
Caine Edna
Birth 20 Feb 1915
Baptism 07 Mar 1915
Residence   1 Amphtill Rd
Father   Albert Graham occupation   Confectioner
Mother Jane Elizabeth
Liverpool Record Office Archive ref 283-AIG-2-1

I would like to explore this family further to see if any of their names match with those of David's DNA matches, however I can't find a marriage for Albert Graham Caine and Jane Elizabeth - or a birth registration for this Edna.  ::)

Margaret
All Census Lookups are Crown Copyright, National Archives for academic and non-commercial research purposes only

ARCHIBALD/ADAMS/BROWN/GORDON/WILSON/Midlothian
CADDY/COPPIN/GEDYE/GIDDEY/GIDDY/GROWDEN/KITT/OLIVER/THOMAS/Cornwall
CAREY/France/Kent/NZ 
CARMICHAEL/GRAHAM/CRAMB/STEWART/Perth
CLOUGH/Lancs/Yorks/NSW
CORNWELL/Kent/NSW 
EATON/Lon/NSW    
MALYON/Mdx  
MATTHEWS/Lon/Sry/Oxf/Glouc/NSW
McLEOD/THOMSON/E Lothian
QUINN/Kilkenny
TUCK/HART/Mdx/Esx
VICCARS/ Lond/Northamps/Hunts
WATSON/Down

Offline margaret1

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Re: WILLIAMS Edna Salford /Manchester -Birth/Death/Parents/Census
« Reply #31 on: Monday 10 August 20 07:22 BST (UK) »
I've started a new topic for the Caine family.

Margaret
All Census Lookups are Crown Copyright, National Archives for academic and non-commercial research purposes only

ARCHIBALD/ADAMS/BROWN/GORDON/WILSON/Midlothian
CADDY/COPPIN/GEDYE/GIDDEY/GIDDY/GROWDEN/KITT/OLIVER/THOMAS/Cornwall
CAREY/France/Kent/NZ 
CARMICHAEL/GRAHAM/CRAMB/STEWART/Perth
CLOUGH/Lancs/Yorks/NSW
CORNWELL/Kent/NSW 
EATON/Lon/NSW    
MALYON/Mdx  
MATTHEWS/Lon/Sry/Oxf/Glouc/NSW
McLEOD/THOMSON/E Lothian
QUINN/Kilkenny
TUCK/HART/Mdx/Esx
VICCARS/ Lond/Northamps/Hunts
WATSON/Down

Offline margaret1

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Re: WILLIAMS Edna Salford /Manchester -Birth/Death/Parents/Census
« Reply #32 on: Wednesday 12 August 20 10:00 BST (UK) »
Success!!! I've found our Edna's family..... :D

https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=835670.0
All Census Lookups are Crown Copyright, National Archives for academic and non-commercial research purposes only

ARCHIBALD/ADAMS/BROWN/GORDON/WILSON/Midlothian
CADDY/COPPIN/GEDYE/GIDDEY/GIDDY/GROWDEN/KITT/OLIVER/THOMAS/Cornwall
CAREY/France/Kent/NZ 
CARMICHAEL/GRAHAM/CRAMB/STEWART/Perth
CLOUGH/Lancs/Yorks/NSW
CORNWELL/Kent/NSW 
EATON/Lon/NSW    
MALYON/Mdx  
MATTHEWS/Lon/Sry/Oxf/Glouc/NSW
McLEOD/THOMSON/E Lothian
QUINN/Kilkenny
TUCK/HART/Mdx/Esx
VICCARS/ Lond/Northamps/Hunts
WATSON/Down

Offline margaret1

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Re: WILLIAMS Edna Salford /Manchester -Birth/Death/Parents/Census
« Reply #33 on: Saturday 08 January 22 20:47 GMT (UK) »
It looks like Hugh and Lydia were living in Denbigh, Wales in 1911.  Hugh was living and working in the county asylum and Lydia was on her own at home.

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:X7V6-PBN

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:X7VX-SDH

It is possible that Edna herself was fostered/adopted.

Debra  :)

Finally confirmation that Edna Williams was indeed adopted/fostered!

In 1921 census 6 year old Edna is living at 9 Piercy Street Failsworth with Hugh Thomas Williams and wife Lydia.

I can't stop smiling.

A big thank you to everyone who gave their time to help with this.

Margaret  :D
All Census Lookups are Crown Copyright, National Archives for academic and non-commercial research purposes only

ARCHIBALD/ADAMS/BROWN/GORDON/WILSON/Midlothian
CADDY/COPPIN/GEDYE/GIDDEY/GIDDY/GROWDEN/KITT/OLIVER/THOMAS/Cornwall
CAREY/France/Kent/NZ 
CARMICHAEL/GRAHAM/CRAMB/STEWART/Perth
CLOUGH/Lancs/Yorks/NSW
CORNWELL/Kent/NSW 
EATON/Lon/NSW    
MALYON/Mdx  
MATTHEWS/Lon/Sry/Oxf/Glouc/NSW
McLEOD/THOMSON/E Lothian
QUINN/Kilkenny
TUCK/HART/Mdx/Esx
VICCARS/ Lond/Northamps/Hunts
WATSON/Down