Samuel Thomas which one ?

[merthyrastley]

Hi everyone
Looking for some help on my Thomas family. Samuel Thomas born 1856 Llanelly married to Sarah born Newport Gwent. I am trying to find Samuels parents  there are two Samuel Thomas' born around the same time. One living with grandparent and other with family any help will be great. Thank you 

[osprey]

Welcome to Rootschat!

Is this the family in 1881?
7 Davies St, Brynmawr RG11/5465 folio 99 pg 45
Samuel Thomas head mar 25 coal miner b., Breconshire, Brynmawr
Sarah J wife 23 b. Mon, Newport
Margaret J dau 8 months b. Brynmawr

More children by 1891 including son name Hezekiah 10 months old. His birth registered june qtr 1890 Crickhowell vol 11b pg 121 mother's maiden name Allen

Marriage Samuel Thomas dec qtr 1879 Crickhowell vol 11b pg 236 with Sarah Jane Allen on the same page.Do you have a copy of this certificate? If not, it will help your search to get it as it would confirm the fathers of both spouses and the occupations of the fathers.
Copies are available from the GRO
https://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/certificates/login.asp

Looking at the 1871 census, I think Samuel the son of David & Elizabeth is unlikely as he is a puddler on that census. RG10/5587 folio 21 pg 11
The Samuel, son of William in Coed Cae Newydd is a miner so possible.
As is the Samuel, nephew to John Jones, and a hallier. RG10/5588 folio 20 pg 33. Also, they're living in Davies Street so in the right area.

The marriage cert is the way to go, doesn't appear to be in the parish marriages online.

[osprey]

That family is in Davies Street in 1861 as well.

1861 Davies St RG9/4220 folio 5 pg 10
Ann Watkins head widow 52 b. Breconshire, Llanelly
William son 15 coal miner b. Llanelly
Samuel Thomas grandson 5 b. Llanelly
+2 boarders
next door
William Waters head mar 29 ballerman b. Mon, Aberystwith
Ruth wife 23 b. Llanelly
Ruth is Ruth Jones in 1871 census.
Marriage reg dec qtr 1857 Crickhowell William Waters vol 11b pg 308 with Ruth Watkins on the same page

Birth reg for this Samuel Thomas dec qtr 1855 Crickhowell vol 11b pg 115 mother's maiden name Watkins

1851 Davies St HO107/2490 folio 492 pg 70
Sam Watkins head mar 49 coal miner b. Herefordshire, Ewyas Harold
Ann wife 46 b. Llanelly
Margaret dau 17 dress maker b. Llanelly
Ruth dau 12 b. Llanelly
William son 6 b. Llanelly
+ a boarder

marriage ref William Thomas dec qtr 1851 Crickhowell vol 26 pg 476 with Margaret Watkins on the same page
possible death reg Margaret Thomas 25 june qtr 1860 Crickhowell vol 11b pg 108
From the parish register
25 Oct 1851 parish church of Llanelly
William Thomas full bachelor collier Brynmawr father david Thomas collier
Margaret Watkins minor spinster Brynmawr father Samuel Watkins collier
witnesses Samuel Watkins & Henry Williams. Margaret & Henry signed, the other 2 marked.

[merthyrastley]

Thank you so very much for your replies and your time looking. Will order the Birth certificate
Best wishes to you both x

[osprey]

both? There's only one of me! 

It's the marriage certificate for Samuel that you need to know the name of his father. The birth cert would be of this Samuel and no guarantee he is yours. He's a good possibility, but you need to be sure of his father's name.

[merthyrastley]

Ha ha going a bit crazy on this line on ths family. They dont make it easy. Samuels daughter Emily (gggrandmam)ends up  marrying John Saunders there was another Samuel Thomas family and Sarah weddings in Bedwellty and a Sarah Price in Newport. Spent 2 days now on John Allen Sarahs father cant see him in 1881 think hes remarried and changed age. The joy of research.

[osprey]

The Sarah with Samuel in Brynmawr has middle initial J on the 1881 census. Birth reg for Sarah Jane Allen march qtr 1857 Newport vol 11a pg 162 mmn Wigley

1871 census 4 Waterloo Place Aberdare RG10/5406 folio 30 pg 6
John Allen head widower 45 fitter b. Leics, Blaby
Mary dau 19 housekeeper b. Cardigan Town
Emily dau 17 working out b. Mon, Newport
Sarah Jane dau 14 b. Newport
Margaret Blanch dau 10 b. Aberdare

1861 23 Hall St, Aberdare RG9/4067 folio 13 pg 20
John Allen head mar 32 engine fitter b. Blaby
Margaret wife 37 b. Cardigan
Mary dau 9 b. Cardigan
Emily dau 6 b. Newport
Sarah J dau 4 b. Newport
Margaret B dau 5 months b. Aberdare
Hannah Wigley sister-in-law 44 dressmaker b. Cardigan

baptisms 18 Nov 1860 parish of Aberdare to John Allen, fitter, and Margaret of Hall St
Emily, Sarah Jane, and Margaret Blanch.

marriage reg
John Allen sept qtr 1848 Cardigan vol 27 pg 49 with Margaret Wigley on the same page

I'm not finding a John Allen from Leicestershire on the 1881 in Wales so far...

 

[merthyrastley]

Awh thank you for your time.  I picked up on the Wigley sister too. I found a John Allen in Llantwit Vairde in 1881 but hes born in 1831 tho but born in Leicestershire. Hes married to a Sarah with a young child. In 1891 they are in Gelligear.  Mary, Emily and Sarah are else where and what I can find is Margaret Blanch dies in a lunacy hospital in 1885. Wonder if hes lying about his age. Wont be the first haha

[osprey]

just found him in 1901 - sorry red post. 1881 census noted Margaret Blanch as deaf.

23 Wine St, Brithdir RG13/5021 folio 47 pg 22
John Allen head mar 76 b. Lester, Blaby
Sarah A wife 50 b. Brynmawr
Christopher son 18 coal miner b. Glam, Treforest
Beatrice C dau 15 b. Mon, Rhymney
Sydney V son 13 coal miner b. Pontlottyn
Oliver S son 11 b. Pontlottyn
Charles W son 9 b. Pontlottyn

baptisms St Tyfaelog, Pontlottyn
21 April 1887 Beatrice Clare daughter of John Allen, fitter, and Sarah Ann
same day Sidney Valentine
same church Oliver Stanley baptised 17 July 1890 address 23 Wine St
birth reg Oliver Stanley Allen dec qtr 1889 Merthyr Tydfil vol 11a pg 519 mmn Ford
Haven't found a marriage reg though...