Author Topic: Jem Collins Fremantle 1939 Register  (Read 739 times)

Offline Pelican

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Jem Collins Fremantle 1939 Register
« on: Thursday 23 July 20 08:06 BST (UK) »
Jem Collins Freemantle was born according to GRO Indexes in the June quarter of 1873, but the 1939 register gives his birthdate as 24 Feb 1875. There is a notation at the side of the entry that seems to refer to a National Health Service event. Can anyone tell me what the notation means please. I tried to attach a copy but as it was a snip from the 1939 register from the column at the side that is used for comments. it would not let me. As far as I can see it says NHS/a/Run 77 018. The a could be a d. It is likely a change of birth date for the National Health Service when it took over the register, but not sure.

I know a bit about him. I think he may have been the son of Samuel Freemantle and Caroline Brown if he was born in 1873.  GRO Indexes do not give a Jem Collins Freemantle born in 1875.

He does not appear in the 1881 census as far as I can see, so he is never with his birth parents. By 1891 he is working at the Eastman Naval Academy in Titchfield as a footman aged 18, so 1873 is correct there.

He married Agnes Howell in 1906. That was in the Stockbridge Registration District so probably her home village of Kings Somborne. She too had been working with the same family and business as a servant.

In the 1911 census they are apart. Agnes is with the employing family in London and Jem in Crawley in Hampshire where the Academy then was. It is of course probable that the family had gone up to their London home for a little while,

There appears to be only one child, a son born in 1915.

Jem Freemantle was in WWi in the Hampshire Regt during WWI and deservedly won the DCM. It is likely he was among the burnt records as I can only find his medal card.

They died in 1953 and 1958.

Offline stanmapstone

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Re: Jem Collins Fremantle 1939 Register
« Reply #1 on: Thursday 23 July 20 08:19 BST (UK) »
Jem Collins Freemantle was born according to GRO Indexes in the June quarter of 1873, but the 1939 register gives his birthdate as 24 Feb 1875.


The GRO Index is when the birth was registered not when he was born.

Stan
Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline Jamjar

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Re: Jem Collins Fremantle 1939 Register
« Reply #2 on: Thursday 23 July 20 09:08 BST (UK) »
Christening, parents James and Sarah: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QRSH-26MM

Mar 1873 Romsey 2c 113
FREEMANTLE James   
GRIFFIN Sarah   
       

Jamjar
Atkinson; Badier; Cameron; Grant; Howie; Jardine; Jenkins; Kerr; Lawardorn; Lee; Linton; Lonie; McConnell; Morgan; Morrison; Murphy; O'Leary; Paton; Pratt; Robb; Williams


Online jonw65

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Re: Jem Collins Fremantle 1939 Register
« Reply #3 on: Thursday 23 July 20 09:12 BST (UK) »
He is Jem or Jam in 1881, but transcribed as Sam Freemantle
Age 8, born Shirley, in Beaulieu
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:Q274-PK8W

Offline Jamjar

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Re: Jem Collins Fremantle 1939 Register
« Reply #4 on: Thursday 23 July 20 09:20 BST (UK) »
He is Jem or Jam in 1881, but transcribed as Sam Freemantle
Age 8, born Shirley, in Beaulieu
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:Q274-PK8W

Then:

Dec 1866 Stockbridge 2c 170
FREEMANTLE James
BROWNE Sarah

I know a bit about him. I think he may have been the son of Samuel Freemantle and Caroline Brown

You should get Jem’s marriage certificate for father’s name.

The BROWNS:

Possible deaths:
BROWN, WILLIAM  66 
GRO Reference: 1870  M Quarter in SHEPTON MALLET  Volume 05C  Page 465
BROWN, MATILDA  71 
GRO Reference: 1883  D Quarter in WELLS  Volume 05C  Page 339

1851: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:SGBF-RZL

1861: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:M7F9-T2L

1871: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:VFJ5-K82

1881: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:Q276-Z8GC

BROWN, THOMAS  CLAVEY mmn CLAVEY 
GRO Reference: 1840  J Quarter in WELLS UNION  Volume 10  Page 489

BROWN, SARAH  ANN mmn CLAVEY 
GRO Reference: 1842  J Quarter in WELLS UNION  Volume 10  Page 517

BROWN, JAMES mmn CLAVEY 
GRO Reference: 1844  S Quarter in WELLS UNION  Volume 10  Page 490

BROWN, CAROLINE mmn CLAVEY 
GRO Reference: 1847  J Quarter in WELLS  Volume 10  Page 503

BROWN, EDWIN mmn CLAVEY 
GRO Reference: 1849  S Quarter in WELLS  Volume 10  Page 458

BROWN, JOHN mmn CLAVEY 
GRO Reference: 1851  S Quarter in WELLS  Volume 10  Page 698

Jamjar
Atkinson; Badier; Cameron; Grant; Howie; Jardine; Jenkins; Kerr; Lawardorn; Lee; Linton; Lonie; McConnell; Morgan; Morrison; Murphy; O'Leary; Paton; Pratt; Robb; Williams

Offline Jamjar

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Re: Jem Collins Fremantle 1939 Register
« Reply #5 on: Thursday 23 July 20 09:29 BST (UK) »
1871: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:VFDB-W6J

1881: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:Q274-PKC9

1891: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:4QQW-HT2

Possible deaths:
FREEMAUTLE, SARAH  54 
GRO Reference: 1896  D Quarter in FAREHAM  Volume 02B  Page 371
FREEMANTLE, JAMES  58 
GRO Reference: 1900  S Quarter in FAREHAM  Volume 02B  Page 379

FREEMANTLE, ELEANOR mmn BROWN 
GRO Reference: 1867  S Quarter in FROME  Volume 05C  Page 549
Married: Dec 1900 Fareham 2b 1210
FISHER William Isaac
FREEMANTLE Eleanor
Possible death:
FISHER, WILLIAM  ISAAC  44 
GRO Reference: 1907  D Quarter in GUILDFORD  Volume 02A  Page 71
1901: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XSXZ-VMG
1911: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XW8T-2PF

FREEMANTLE, MARION mmn BROWN 
GRO Reference: 1868  D Quarter in STOCKBRIDGE  Volume 02C  Page 84

FREEMANTLE, AMY mmn BROWN 
GRO Reference: 1871  J Quarter in STOCKBRIDGE  Volume 02C  Page 78
1891: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:43Y2-H2M
1901: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XSXC-VJS
1911: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XWQM-ZXH
Possible death:
Jun 1961 Leeds 2cn508
FREEMANTLE Amy 90   

FREEMANTLE, JEM  COLLINS mmn BROWN 
GRO Reference: 1873  J Quarter in SOUTH STONEHAM  Volume 02C  Page 55
Christening: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QRSH-26MM
Married: Jun 1906 Stockbridge 2c 19
FREEMANTLE Jem Collins
HOWELL Agnes
1891: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:4QQZ-9ZM
1901: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XSXY-FR1
1911: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XWQG-3FR

FREEMANTLE, HARRY mmn BROWN 
GRO Reference: 1876  J Quarter in SOUTH STONEHAM  Volume 02C  Page 57
Christening: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QPR8-L4L5
1891: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QDD4-HPZ
1911: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:X72R-ZHH

FREEMANTLE, LILIAN mmn BROWN 
GRO Reference: 1879  D Quarter in NEW FOREST  Volume 02B  Page 674

FREEMANTLE, IRIS mmn BROWN 
GRO Reference: 1881  D Quarter in SOUTH STONEHAM  Volume 02C  Page 80
Possible death: Mar 1962 Winchester    6b 993
FREEMANTLE Iris 80
1911: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XWQM-ZF6

FREEMANTLE, ETHEL  BEATRICE mmn BROWN 
GRO Reference: 1884  S Quarter in FAREHAM  Volume 02B  Page 564
Death: Dec 1962 Portsmouth 6b 473
FREEMANTLE Ethel B  78
1901: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XSXZ-VMG
1911: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XWQM-ZXH

Jamjar
Atkinson; Badier; Cameron; Grant; Howie; Jardine; Jenkins; Kerr; Lawardorn; Lee; Linton; Lonie; McConnell; Morgan; Morrison; Murphy; O'Leary; Paton; Pratt; Robb; Williams

Online nanny jan

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Re: Jem Collins Fremantle 1939 Register
« Reply #6 on: Thursday 23 July 20 10:04 BST (UK) »
Birthdates on the register can be wrong;  my grandpa gave the wrong date, month and year!   He was very surprised when he got his Old Age Pension....he was older than he thought he was.  ::)
Howard , Viney , Kingsman, Pain/e, Rainer/ Rayner, Barham, George, Wakeling (Catherine), Vicary (Frederick)   all LDN area/suburbs  Ottley/ MDX,
Henman/ KNT   Gandy/LDN before 1830  Burgess/LDN
Barham/SFK   Rainer/CAN (Toronto) Gillians/CAN  Sturgeon/CAN (Vancouver)
Bailey/LDN Page/KNT   Paling/WA (var)



All census look-ups are crown copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline Pelican

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Re: Jem Collins Fremantle 1939 Register
« Reply #7 on: Friday 24 July 20 06:59 BST (UK) »
What a wonderful response for this hero. Thank you all very much indeed. This is appreciated.

Being a pensioner I can only get certificates for the direct line, this brave man is on the fringes but I want him recognised in our family archives for his war service. His DCM deserves that. We have several folk in the family from the 1800s on in those archives.

Your Grandpa certainly did get a surprise, Nanny Jan. Loved that story!

That was my original reaction Stanmapstone. How could a child registered in 1873 have a birthdate in 1875 and even the wrong quarter. People made those entries themselves and the powers that be put them together. I bet that was a mistake, reading another date and putting that down. Distracted would be a simple error.

Now I must go and have an interesting time sorting out the rest of this interesting information. Looks like two possibles at first glance. Will get back to you.









Offline Pelican

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Re: Jem Collins Fremantle 1939 Register
« Reply #8 on: Friday 24 July 20 08:10 BST (UK) »
Thank you very much indeed for all this wonderful help. Without a shadow of doubt Jem Collins Freemantle is the one born in Shirley to James and Sarah Freemantle nee Browne!!!

James and Sarah were married in the Stockbridge Registration District in the December quarter of 1866. Exactly the right area.

Bless you.