Author Topic: A John James or two!  (Read 199 times)

Offline Trees

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A John James or two!
« on: Wednesday 05 August 20 16:02 BST (UK) »
When John Jefferies, Of Stoke Lane otherwise Stoke St Michael in the county of Somerset, made his will in 1767 he made John James a farmer of West Horrington an executor along with his wife.
Question 1: is why?? I can not find a connection between the two men, and the only one that fits the place and occupation on the 1861 and 1871 census was born in 1826.
That leads to the next mystery
Exeter and Plymouth Gazette 13 March 1830
A public house, at Coleford Somerset, the property of Mr. Jefferies, caught fire on Saturday...
In 1830 the King's Head in Coleford was burnt down and an old web site (no longer available) suggested that John James had owned several pubs in the area and he acted quickly to rebuild this one.
Question 2:Did John James or John Jefferies own the pub? In 1832 John Jefferies is on the electors roll by virtue of having the pub free hold.
Question 3: What is the connection of John Jefferies who apparently owned several pubs in 1830 and the John James chosen as an executor in 1867?
Question 4; Will any of this help me find out which pub John Jefferies kept from 1821 when he was a publican on his children's baptisms in Mells (there was no church in Coleford at that time)?
The BIGGEST question is can anyone help Please?
Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

For details of my research interests please see
mcmullin.me.uk
Also read the children a story from Story Time at the same web site.

Offline Geoff

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Re: A John James or two!
« Reply #1 on: Thursday 06 August 20 03:49 BST (UK) »
Trees,
Maybe the connection is the wife, was she his sister ?
Why would you expect to find answers in the 1861/71 census, he made his will in 1767 which would suggest he was born in the 1740's at the latest, the 1861 census he would have been at least 120 years old. These would be one or even two generations later when the pub burnt down.

Geoff
**  Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk **
Martock,Pilton,Doulting & Frome:MASTERS,
Pilton: PORCH,BOULTON,  Frome; HACKETT,
Combe Hay, HINTON,WEEKS,
Perthshire: CRICHTON,TAYLOR,MOON,IRONS,KIDD
Durham: FENWICK,PUNSHON,EDDY,{HENRY aka LAVERICK}
NBL: BUCHANAN, HODGSON, HALL
LIN: MASKEY,BIRD,FISHER,HARLEY,
CAM: CROSS,FOREMAN,FREEMAN,ONG,
FEAST,MOXON
GLS; HILL,COX,NEWELL
Sussex: CHAPMAN,NEVE,DOWNER
Surrey: NEWELL,WEBB,
HRTS; BEECROFT, ELLINGHAM,

Offline Nanna52

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Re: A John James or two!
« Reply #2 on: Thursday 06 August 20 05:55 BST (UK) »
In the late 1920s when my grandmother made her will the executors were completely unknown to me.  She had five brothers and sisters, why not them?  It took me months of searching back to find that one was a cousin, her mother and my 2 X great grandmother were sisters.  The other was the husband of a cousin descended from another sister of my 2 X great grandmother.  He was a businessman and I found others who made him an executor in their wills.

I also believe that there was a lack of family unity as she was left out of her mothers Will And was not included in her obituary.  Would love to know why.
James -Victoria, Australia originally from Keynsham, Somerset.
Janes - Keynsham and Bristol area.
Heale/Hale - Keynsham, Somerset
Vincent - Illogan/Redruth, Cornwall.  Moved to Sculcoates, Yorkshire; Grass Valley, California; Timaru, New Zealand and Victoria, Australia.
Williams somewhere in Wales - he kept moving
Ellis - Anglesey

Gedmatch A327531


Offline Jo Harding

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Re: A John James or two!
« Reply #3 on: Thursday 06 August 20 14:50 BST (UK) »
It might be helpful to post a link to a previous post that relates to this:

https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=469327.0

There is a reference to The King's Head, Coleford and John Jeffries in this link if you scroll down:

http://mcmullin.me.uk/occupations/pub_still_more.html

The baptisms in Mells show John Jeffries to be of an abode in Kilmersdon and a Publican, or Victualler. The pub that comes up on a search of Kilmersdon is The Joliffe Arms. Have you looked to see if he was connected to this?

Jo



Offline Trees

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Re: A John James or two!
« Reply #4 on: Friday 07 August 20 07:41 BST (UK) »
Me being daft he made the will in 1867
The John James born 1826 was in 1861, married to an Elizabeth  from Stoke Lane as was John Jefferies third wife Ann Cornish. Ann Cornish had a sister Elizabeth who married a John Swayne and I now have found that John James married an Elizabeth SWAINE  this gives a very loos but feasible connection to the executor.
Next I have now found that John James(1826) was the son of John James(1805) now this must be the chap who "owned" the various pubs, One son-in -law was a butcher innkeeper in Shepton Mallet  in 1861 and a son was landlord of The Slab in Haydon so it is possible James did own these two at least
So many thanks your comments made me look for the relationship and has proved very interesting.
You will find the mcmullin site is my own we have recently changed provider and are reviewing all the old pages hence this present search Yes I have looked at the Jolliffe but without much joy!
I still can't understand if John Jefferies was a tenant or owner of the King's Head  He held the free hold in 1832 did this mean he was the owner? And then there is the newspaper Exeter and Plymouth Gazette 13 March 1830
A public house, at Coleford Somerset, the property of Mr. Jefferies, ...
So he was there before the fire but his will makes no mention of the pub only 10 cottages he owned in Coleford
Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

For details of my research interests please see
mcmullin.me.uk
Also read the children a story from Story Time at the same web site.