Author Topic: Finding Elizabeth Hayes, born abt 1833, Belfast  (Read 624 times)

Offline jonw65

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Re: Finding Elizabeth Hayes, born abt 1833, Belfast
« Reply #18 on: Friday 14 August 20 20:20 BST (UK) »
Hi Mark
Yes, there should be some sort of pension record for Samuel Hayes of the 47th Regiment. It will be on the site that also has the Portsmouth images (and I don't have!)

In the 1851 census I read his occupation as Pensioner, so am not surprised at the military angle. Could those birth places given in 1851 be a bit mixed up? :-\

Do you know what Samuel's occupation on the Portsmouth baptism was, because the info from ancestry is that he was discharged from the army in 1832
Samuel Hayes
Born 1792, Warington, Lancaster
Enlisted 1808
Discharged 1832
Reg 47th Regt Of Foot
Reg No. 14

That the same Elizabeth was baptized twice would certainly make sense, though I agree that it is not entirely logical! And there are those extra names.
John

Offline jonw65

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Re: Finding Elizabeth Hayes, born abt 1833, Belfast
« Reply #19 on: Friday 14 August 20 20:24 BST (UK) »
That army record in WO 97 is indexed on TNA
SAMUEL HAYES Born WARRINGTON, Lancashire Served in 47th Foot Regiment Discharged aged 40
https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C8759726

Offline Buffnut453

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Re: Finding Elizabeth Hayes, born abt 1833, Belfast
« Reply #20 on: Friday 14 August 20 20:34 BST (UK) »
Hi Mark
Yes, there should be some sort of pension record for Samuel Hayes of the 47th Regiment. It will be on the site that also has the Portsmouth images (and I don't have!)

In the 1851 census I read his occupation as Pensioner, so am not surprised at the military angle. Could those birth places given in 1851 be a bit mixed up? :-\

Do you know what Samuel's occupation on the Portsmouth baptism was, because the info from ancestry is that he was discharged from the army in 1832
Samuel Hayes
Born 1792, Warington, Lancaster
Enlisted 1808
Discharged 1832
Reg 47th Regt Of Foot
Reg No. 14

That the same Elizabeth was baptized twice would certainly make sense, though I agree that it is not entirely logical! And there are those extra names.
John

Hi Jon,

The Portsea Christening record lists Samuel's occupation as "Pensioner" which tallies with the known military information about him. 

Looks like we're slowly (quite rapidly, actually) untangling this mystery, although there are still some confusing elements...like Elizabeth's extra names, as you said. 


Offline jonw65

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Re: Finding Elizabeth Hayes, born abt 1833, Belfast
« Reply #21 on: Friday 14 August 20 20:51 BST (UK) »
There was an Eliza Jane Searle baptized in Portsea in 1809
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:N5K2-ZFJ

And ancestry also have Saml Hayes b 1792 of the 47th Foot in their Royal Hospital Kilmainham Pensioner Discharge Documents, 1724-1924.
Date of discharge 12/12/32

Hopefully that will tally. Was he then discharged in Ireland and then Elizabeth might have been born there in late 1832?
John

Eventually I will be able to look at these documents again. I hope!

Offline Buffnut453

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Re: Finding Elizabeth Hayes, born abt 1833, Belfast
« Reply #22 on: Friday 14 August 20 20:57 BST (UK) »
There was an Eliza Jane Searle baptized in Portsea in 1809
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:N5K2-ZFJ

And ancestry also have Saml Hayes b 1792 of the 47th Foot in their Royal Hospital Kilmainham Pensioner Discharge Documents, 1724-1924.
Date of discharge 12/12/32

Hopefully that will tally. Was he then discharged in Ireland and then Elizabeth might have been born there in late 1832?
John

Eventually I will be able to look at these documents again. I hope!

A late-1832 birth date for Elizabeth makes some sense, and tallies with her burial record in August 1901 which gives her birth year as 1832. 

I saw the Christening record for Eliza Jane Searle in Portsea.  Desipte all the Census records, it seems that neither Elizabeth nor her mother were actually Irish. 

Offline jonw65

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Re: Finding Elizabeth Hayes, born abt 1833, Belfast
« Reply #23 on: Friday 14 August 20 21:05 BST (UK) »
Hi Mark
We all like to have Irish ancestors, or at least one or two!
My main male line goes back to Belfast and just outside, and before very long comes to a total stop :( Which is not unusual in Ireland!
So, although it is perhaps unexpected - and not really what I was expecting - you should have much better luck with Hayes in Warrington, and Searle in Portsmouth.

So a good result for you.
John

Offline Buffnut453

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Re: Finding Elizabeth Hayes, born abt 1833, Belfast
« Reply #24 on: Friday 14 August 20 21:15 BST (UK) »
It's an outstanding result on so many levels.  I've cleared a blockage that's been bugging me for years.  On top of it all, I managed to download Samuel's service record so I have specific dates, locations and even a physical description of the man.  I have a lot of information to go through now.

I truly appreciate your help over the past few days.  Your help has been absolutely invaluable.  Thank you so much for all the time and searches you've expended on my behalf.

Kind regards,
Mark

Offline jonw65

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Re: Finding Elizabeth Hayes, born abt 1833, Belfast
« Reply #25 on: Friday 14 August 20 21:21 BST (UK) »
You're welcome!
Good luck.
John

Offline Buffnut453

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Re: Finding Elizabeth Hayes, born abt 1833, Belfast
« Reply #26 on: Saturday 15 August 20 16:55 BST (UK) »
There was an Eliza Jane Searle baptized in Portsea in 1809
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:N5K2-ZFJ

And ancestry also have Saml Hayes b 1792 of the 47th Foot in their Royal Hospital Kilmainham Pensioner Discharge Documents, 1724-1924.
Date of discharge 12/12/32

Hopefully that will tally. Was he then discharged in Ireland and then Elizabeth might have been born there in late 1832?
John

Eventually I will be able to look at these documents again. I hope!

Hi John (yes, I finally clued into the fact that I was mis-spelling your name...sorry!),

Yes, the Kilmainham record does tally with Samuel.  His service records discuss medical discharge due to a liver complaint in Oct 1832, and it appears he was finally discharged from hospital in Ireland on 12 Dec.  That would definitely align with daughter Elizabeth being born in 1832.

I did some digging into Samuel's service record and he participated in the Battle of Vitoria and the Siege of San Sebastian, both in 1813.  Following the Peninsula War his unit deployed to India and may have been involved in actions there, in Burma and in the Middle East.  He certainly got around!

I've ordered birth and death certificates for a number of Elizabeth's siblings.  Hope to get them in a week's time. 

Kind regards,
Mark