Author Topic: When did Agnes Alexander/Ireland arrive in Australia from Scotland?  (Read 326 times)

Offline Westby

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When did Agnes Alexander/Ireland arrive in Australia from Scotland?
« on: Monday 31 August 20 05:15 BST (UK) »
I'm hoping some of those who are expert in shipping records and passenger lists can help me to find when Agnes Alexander/Ireland came to Australia. She arrived between 1868 and 1871. She may have travelled under her maiden name or her married name.

Here's some of what I know about her:

Agnes Dick Alice Alexander
Born Dundee Scotland in 1839
Father Alexander Alexander
Mother Elizabeth Low

Married Thomas Ireland (B: 1837) in  1860 and had 4 children

James Playfair IRELAND (1861 - 1892)
Alexander IRELAND (1863 - 1871)
Elizabeth Low IRELAND (1866 - 1929)
Janet Duff IRELAND (1868 - 1943)

It seems second son Alexander died in April 1871, and husband Thomas died in October the same year.

I haven’t been able to discover when Agnes went to Australia. Did she leave before the death of her husband and son? I assume both her young daughters (Elizabeth and Janet) traveled with her.

Agnes was in Australia when she gave birth to an illegitimate daughter, Agnes Alexander (Ireland) in April 1871. There is no father on Agnes’ birth certificate, but the name IRELAND was added later. She lived as a “housekeeper” with another Thomas Ireland who is described as “an uncle by marriage” - perhaps her husband’s uncle.

Thanks in advance.
Bayley family of Westmorland (Casterton/Kirkby Lonsdale) and Lancashire (Barton, Birkdale) during the period 1750 - 1911.
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Offline majm

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Re: When did Agnes Alexander/Ireland arrive in Australia from Scotland?
« Reply #1 on: Monday 31 August 20 06:09 BST (UK) »
Hi,

Do you have the birth cert for the baby born April 1871?

What colony was the birth registered in?

What info is recorded there re baby's mum  ... age, birthplace, occupation, usual address .. 

What is the source for the baby's birth cert having an amendment later to include more details .... is it a change signed off by the Registrar or perhaps an unauthorised  note added a generation later by a researcher noting the Scottish husband's details.

I'm hoping some of those who are expert in shipping records and passenger lists can help me to find when Agnes Alexander/Ireland came to Australia. She arrived between 1868 and 1871. She may have travelled under her maiden name or her married name.

Here's some of what I know about her:

Agnes Dick Alice Alexander
Born Dundee Scotland in 1839
Father Alexander Alexander
Mother Elizabeth Low

Married Thomas Ireland (B: 1837) in  1860 and had 4 children

James Playfair IRELAND (1861 - 1892)
Alexander IRELAND (1863 - 1871)
Elizabeth Low IRELAND (1866 - 1929)
Janet Duff IRELAND (1868 - 1943)

It seems second son Alexander died in April 1871, and husband Thomas died in October the same year.

I haven’t been able to discover when Agnes went to Australia. Did she leave before the death of her husband and son? I assume both her young daughters (Elizabeth and Janet) traveled with her.

Agnes was in Australia when she gave birth to an illegitimate daughter, Agnes Alexander (Ireland) in April 1871. There is no father on Agnes’ birth certificate, but the name IRELAND was added later. She lived as a “housekeeper” with another Thomas Ireland who is described as “an uncle by marriage” - perhaps her husband’s uncle.

Thanks in advance.


JM
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Offline majm

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Re: When did Agnes Alexander/Ireland arrive in Australia from Scotland?
« Reply #2 on: Monday 31 August 20 06:22 BST (UK) »
NSWBDM online index,  1080/1871.

The birth is indexed twice,  but in both instances it is under the family name of IRELAND.

Alexander would likely be one of the baby's Christian names.

NSW Bdm birth registrations did not allocate any surname to any baby until the late 1960s.   IRELAND was likely the surname that baby's mum was using when the birth was registered.

JM
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Offline Jamjar

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Re: When did Agnes Alexander/Ireland arrive in Australia from Scotland?
« Reply #3 on: Monday 31 August 20 06:27 BST (UK) »
NSWBDM online index,  1080/1871.

The birth is indexed twice,  but in both instances it is under the family name of IRELAND.

Alexander would likely be one of the baby's Christian names.

NSW Bdm birth registrations did not allocate any surname to any baby until the late 1960s.   IRELAND was likely the surname that baby's mum was using when the birth was registered.

JM

And the mother is ALICE.

Jamjar
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Offline Jamjar

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Re: When did Agnes Alexander/Ireland arrive in Australia from Scotland?
« Reply #4 on: Monday 31 August 20 06:43 BST (UK) »
6026/1890 WATT Edmund to IRELAND Janet D
8668/1943 WATT Jessie Duff parents THOMAS and AGNES

4362/1891 TOYER James to IRELAND Agnes A
Died 3 January 1952 - I can’t see it on NSWBDM
Death and funeral notices: http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article18261049

7051/1892 TOYER Frederick to IRELAND Elizabeth
21815/1929 TOYER Elizabeth parents THOMAS and AGNES

Jamjar


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Offline Westby

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Re: When did Agnes Alexander/Ireland arrive in Australia from Scotland?
« Reply #5 on: Monday 31 August 20 07:28 BST (UK) »
Thanks all. 

The issue around the child's birth is interesting. The full birth name of Agnes, the mother is Agnes Dick Alice ALEXANDER, so it looks as though she might have been using a different first name when she arrived. 

She certainly chops and changes. In a coroners report on the death of Thomas Ireland in 1874 (person for whom she was a "housekeeper), she gives her name as Agnes Ireland, but when she married Robert Anderson in 1877, she was recorded as Agnes Alexander, spinster. 
Bayley family of Westmorland (Casterton/Kirkby Lonsdale) and Lancashire (Barton, Birkdale) during the period 1750 - 1911.
Willan family of Westmorland and Lancashire.
Easthope family - mostly Gloucestershire/London
Jeffords

Offline majm

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Re: When did Agnes Alexander/Ireland arrive in Australia from Scotland?
« Reply #6 on: Monday 31 August 20 07:45 BST (UK) »
Hi there.

Re that 1877 marriage, is it reference no. 549? .... if you have a copy of it,  may I ask for some further info ....

what info is recorded there regarding the bride, her age, her birthplace, her usual address, her occupation both her parents ... and what denomination and the name of the clergyman, and the official witnesses...

Please check for the details of when the 1877 civil registration was reconciled by NSW BDM to the church registers...  if you have the NSW BDM cert, it should be in the far right hand margin area, and if you have an official transcription it should be in the notes the transcriber provides.

JM
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Offline majm

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Re: When did Agnes Alexander/Ireland arrive in Australia from Scotland?
« Reply #7 on: Monday 31 August 20 07:59 BST (UK) »
Do you have the birth cert (or official transcription) for Emily Windom W ANDERSON?  NSW BDM reference 6458/1881.  It should give you details about Emily's two older siblings, Lilly S (#4221/1877) and Jane Rogers (#5232/1879).

Emily was born 29 July 1881, and her birth registered in the Newtown district.  Agnes would have been about 42 years of age when Emily was born.

Were Robert and Agnes residents of Denison Street, Camperdown?    I have ancestors who were stonemasons, and I can see that some decades ago I researched many of the stonemasons in the inner west suburbs of Sydney including Camperdown, Ultimo, Pyrmont etc who were working on the construction sites in the Sydney CBD in the 1870s.   One of the buildings was the GPO.

JM



 



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Offline Jamjar

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Re: When did Agnes Alexander/Ireland arrive in Australia from Scotland?
« Reply #8 on: Monday 31 August 20 08:03 BST (UK) »
What is recorded on the death certificate for Agnes Snr?

I can’t see a suitable death for her.

Jamjar
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