Author Topic: Mysterious gathering in 1851  (Read 2989 times)

Offline Ian Nelson

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Re: Mysterious gathering in 1851
« Reply #36 on: Thursday 17 September 20 11:00 BST (UK) »
Is there any way to find out what issues were before the Court at that time?   An Inquiry into a ship loss?  These Merchants are from all over the world, Canada, United States, Colombo + Ecuador, Spain, Portugal, Russia and Ireland, not counting England and Scotland.  Curious that there was a damaged ship called the William Wilson when we have William Wilson (Solicitor) connected to the Wilsons resident at the Adelphi.
Perhaps they are Joint owners of a ship or the cargo and there has been an incident with loss.
I suspect Mary Ann Bergins is an alias for Liverpool Lou.   I'm going to Google all those Merchants, later, because I need to get out more :o
Norfolk, Nelsons of Gt Ryburgh, Gooch, Howman, COLLISONS,  Ainger, Couzens, Batrick (Norfolk & Dorset), Tubby ( also of Yorkshire) Cathcarts of Ireland, Lancashire & Isle of Wight) Dickinsons of Morecambe and Lancaster, Wilson of Poulton-le-Sands and Broughton.  Wilson - Ffrance of Rawcliffe,  Mitchells of Isle of Wight. Hair of Ayrshire, Williamson of Tradeston, Glasgow. Nelsons in Australia with Haywards Heath connections.

Offline Ian Nelson

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Re: Mysterious gathering in 1851
« Reply #37 on: Thursday 17 September 20 11:01 BST (UK) »
Thanks to all who have added to the knowledge .... together we'll solve the mystery and find the 'patsy'.
Norfolk, Nelsons of Gt Ryburgh, Gooch, Howman, COLLISONS,  Ainger, Couzens, Batrick (Norfolk & Dorset), Tubby ( also of Yorkshire) Cathcarts of Ireland, Lancashire & Isle of Wight) Dickinsons of Morecambe and Lancaster, Wilson of Poulton-le-Sands and Broughton.  Wilson - Ffrance of Rawcliffe,  Mitchells of Isle of Wight. Hair of Ayrshire, Williamson of Tradeston, Glasgow. Nelsons in Australia with Haywards Heath connections.

Offline Maiden Stone

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Re: Mysterious gathering in 1851
« Reply #38 on: Thursday 17 September 20 12:34 BST (UK) »
Is there any way to find out what issues were before the Court at that time?   

I suspect Mary Ann Bergins is an alias for Liverpool Lou.   
Newspapers?
No old age pensions for ordinary working girls in those days. Liverpool Lou would have had to keep on working for as long as possible.
What interests did the Earl of Selkirk have?
Cowban

Offline djm297

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Re: Mysterious gathering in 1851
« Reply #39 on: Thursday 17 September 20 13:10 BST (UK) »
In February the Assizes were at Lancaster , and there is a newspaper account stating that "In accordance with ancient custom", the High Sherriff of Lancashire, processed through the town to meet the Judges. Amongst the gentlemen present are "Mr J W R Wilson-under sheriff and son".

In the Liverpool Mercury  in March/ April 1851 , there is a similar account of the High Sheriff's procession-describing his coach, together with accounts of the Court proceedings. However I can not find any mention of the Wilsons!

djm297


Offline Ian Nelson

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Re: Mysterious gathering in 1851
« Reply #40 on: Thursday 17 September 20 16:07 BST (UK) »
Dunbar James DOUGLAS
6th Earl of Selkirk, aka Lord Daer.  He held the office of Lord-Lieutenant of the Stewartry of Kirkcudbright between 1844 and 1885.1 He held the office of Keeper of the Great Seal [Scotland] between August 1852 and December 1852.1 He held the office of Keeper of the Great Seal [Scotland] from 1858 to 1859.  The DOUGLASes were prominent Celtic-Norman Aristocracy along with Robert the Bruce, etc!   He married Cecily Louisa Grey-Egerton, daughter of Sir Philip de Malpas Grey-Egerton, 10th Bt.
He was not a lawyer but could represent the Crown in certain Proceedings and Ceremonials.

Norfolk, Nelsons of Gt Ryburgh, Gooch, Howman, COLLISONS,  Ainger, Couzens, Batrick (Norfolk & Dorset), Tubby ( also of Yorkshire) Cathcarts of Ireland, Lancashire & Isle of Wight) Dickinsons of Morecambe and Lancaster, Wilson of Poulton-le-Sands and Broughton.  Wilson - Ffrance of Rawcliffe,  Mitchells of Isle of Wight. Hair of Ayrshire, Williamson of Tradeston, Glasgow. Nelsons in Australia with Haywards Heath connections.

Offline Ian Nelson

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Re: Mysterious gathering in 1851
« Reply #41 on: Thursday 17 September 20 16:12 BST (UK) »
There is a line of Lawyers in the Wilson clan.   I have it somewhere in my files about JWR Wilson, I think, receiving something in the will of someone's wife's uncle using the surname Ffrance and he added it to his own name but some of his sons did not and remained as Wilsons even though their brothers and cousins present at their weddings were mostly known as Wilson-France.  I think Broughton and a nearby estate were involved. 
http://thepeerage.com/p45538.htm#i455371
Thomas Robert Wilson Ffrance of Rawcliffe Hall, Lancashire
Squire John ffrance (1727–1817), was the son of John ffrance Senior and Elizabeth, daughter of Thomas Roe, and he lived at Rawcliffe Hall in the Fylde, about 5 miles from Cockerham
Norfolk, Nelsons of Gt Ryburgh, Gooch, Howman, COLLISONS,  Ainger, Couzens, Batrick (Norfolk & Dorset), Tubby ( also of Yorkshire) Cathcarts of Ireland, Lancashire & Isle of Wight) Dickinsons of Morecambe and Lancaster, Wilson of Poulton-le-Sands and Broughton.  Wilson - Ffrance of Rawcliffe,  Mitchells of Isle of Wight. Hair of Ayrshire, Williamson of Tradeston, Glasgow. Nelsons in Australia with Haywards Heath connections.

Offline Ian Nelson

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Re: Mysterious gathering in 1851
« Reply #42 on: Friday 18 September 20 01:53 BST (UK) »
Lighting a candle to show the way .... perhaps.
https://web.archive.org/web/20090904184055/http://www.prices-candles.co.uk/history/historydetail.asp

Wilson and Lancaster formed a Candle Company and named it the Edward Price Company later dropping the Edward and it became the World's largest Candle Company, then expanded into Oils and other chemicals and when their factory at Battersea became too small they BUILT A FACTORY AT LIVERPOOL.
They imported palm oil from Indonesia, tallow from Russia, coconuts from West Africa and possibly South America.
In 1830 a middle-aged Scotsman living in London was considering his business future. He was no stranger to commercial failure. As a young man in Scotland he had seen the collapse of his father's iron works in 1812 during the economic slump of the Napoleonic Wars. He had then traveled south to London and set himself up as a successful merchant in the 'Russia trade', importing goods from Moscow and St Petersburg. Now at the age of 58, William Wilson, was approached by his partner, with an invitation to go into a new venture: candle manufacture.

I'm still trying to find a list of investors and shareholders in Price's Candles and a list of Victorian Solicitors, Attorneys & Barristers.
but I'm beginning to see the light regarding the guests at the Adelphi
Norfolk, Nelsons of Gt Ryburgh, Gooch, Howman, COLLISONS,  Ainger, Couzens, Batrick (Norfolk & Dorset), Tubby ( also of Yorkshire) Cathcarts of Ireland, Lancashire & Isle of Wight) Dickinsons of Morecambe and Lancaster, Wilson of Poulton-le-Sands and Broughton.  Wilson - Ffrance of Rawcliffe,  Mitchells of Isle of Wight. Hair of Ayrshire, Williamson of Tradeston, Glasgow. Nelsons in Australia with Haywards Heath connections.

Offline Maiden Stone

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Re: Mysterious gathering in 1851
« Reply #43 on: Friday 18 September 20 22:24 BST (UK) »
Have you been you burning the candle at both ends, researching until the early hours?
Has anyone mentioned "The London Gazette" for business news?
Cowban

Offline Ian Nelson

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Re: Mysterious gathering in 1851
« Reply #44 on: Friday 18 September 20 23:06 BST (UK) »
There was oil in my lamp so I kept it burning, until the wee small hours.  I think most folks will know something about Port Sunlight but will they know that Price's Candles built a model village for their workers in the new Wirral factory before Lever got around to it.
http://allertonoak.net/GSM/03GSMPortSunlightPrices.html
Bromborough Pool predated Port Sunlight.
All the Adelphi guests could have been present for the factory opening and to plan and agree to add the model village.
I'm still chasing up all the characters  ... I'm sure there is a story in there worth telling.  Even the history of Wilsontown is fascinating, especially as I called into Forth & Wilsontown  regularly 40 to 50 years ago on business. 
Norfolk, Nelsons of Gt Ryburgh, Gooch, Howman, COLLISONS,  Ainger, Couzens, Batrick (Norfolk & Dorset), Tubby ( also of Yorkshire) Cathcarts of Ireland, Lancashire & Isle of Wight) Dickinsons of Morecambe and Lancaster, Wilson of Poulton-le-Sands and Broughton.  Wilson - Ffrance of Rawcliffe,  Mitchells of Isle of Wight. Hair of Ayrshire, Williamson of Tradeston, Glasgow. Nelsons in Australia with Haywards Heath connections.