Catherine Spicer - bapt. 1710c Berks - (mar. Richard Belcher 1734 Stanford)

[ribbo39]

Hi LizzieL,

I have to say yes to all the records you have found. I noticed these entries myself  in going thru all the CDs I have acquired over the years.
It just seems that there must be some records which have not been included in the transcripts,  for others to have perused to come up with. (missing BTs??)

Where do people find an exact date of 31-12-1710 in Stanford from? 

I have another thread going about an a marriage in West Challow in 1759, but records for that parish are included with those of East Challow but entered in Letcombe Regis and this is on the IGI.  A mystery.

Alan

[LizzieL]

The date of 31 Dec 1710 is actually from the transcript of the Upton register. Too many people make the assumption that people are born in the same place they marry in. Maybe they appear missing from transcripts because they have been transcribed badly - not always transcriber's fault, spelling was a bit arbitrary in the past, records get damaged / faded and some clerks had poor handwriting.

St Lawrence, West Challow is a very small church, maybe it was technically a chapel back then. I was looking for some baptism records 20 + years ago from there. They were from the 1820s. After the usual ping pong between Berks RO and Oxon RO "We haven't got them try the other RO", it transpired that they were still at the church. They were still using the register they started in 1812 /13. The vicar was responsible for several parishes inc Letcombe R at the time - possibly more now. Maybe that's why the IGI puts them all together.
 
I found Augustine's will. He had oldest son Laurence, another son Francis and daughter Katherine (White). Matching set of children b East Hendred between 1643 and 1648 - parents Augustine and Mary. He mentions property in Goosey as well as EH. Mentions wife Elizabeth. There is marriage of Augustine and an Elizabeth in EH a few years before his death. Mary wife of Augustine buried EH 13 May 1675
Can't find Katherine's marriage to a Mr White.
Upton much closer to EH than Stanford is. Will establishes family had interests in both EH, Goosey / Stanford.

[Galium]

Hi, I haven't looked into Catherine's family a great deal (Catherine and Richard Belcher are in my husband's tree), but for what it's worth I have taken the Upton baptism to be of the same person as the Catherine Spicer who married Richard Belcher. 

Upton is only about 20 miles away from Stanford in the Vale, and these seem to be people who are well off and move around a bit.  Also, one of Catherine and Richard's sons is named Lawrence, which doesn't seem to be a Belcher family name.

added I don't know whether you have read Richard Belcher's will of 1786, but among the several properties he bequeaths are some in the parish of St Botolph Aldgate in London - which implies that the distance from Upton to Stanford in the Vale would not seem great to this family. Also, he mentions a joint purchase of property made between him and Lawrence Spicer of Abingdon. I believe this is his brother in law, although he doesn't say.

[Sloe Gin]

Upton to Stanford is only about 15 miles via Wantage, with the Hendreds on the road between. 

[ribbo39]

Hi all,

Thanks for all your valuable help.
It seems that Catherine Spyser (Spicer) bapt. 1710 (d/o Laurance & Elizabeth) in Upton is the one who married Richard Belcher, although her parents didn't marry until 1715 in West Hendred, unless there is another couple with same names.

I believe Laurence Spicer was bapt. 23-1-1677 Stanford (in Goosey Chapel, s/o Laurance & Ann Champe).

Lawrence Spiser - m - Anne Champe 3-10-1675 East Hendred.
Ann Champe bapt. 24-8-1646 E.Hendred (d/o Richard & Mary)

Lawrence Spicer bapt. 26-6-1648 Stamford (in Goosey)  (s/o John & Alice Ryman).

I've just done another search of all the parishes nearby and have amassed a collection of "Spicer/Spyser" families from about 1558 to the late 1700s who mainly started off in Goosey but are recorded in Stanford registers and found that there are no less than six Lawrence/Laurence Spicer  generations.

Interestingly, Richard Belcher (b.1786) to Laurence & Mary Spicer married a Mary Ann Spicer Anger in Little Hinton, Wilts (d/o John Anger & Elizabeth. Another connection or just a coincidence?

Alan

[Galium]

Hi Alan, apologies if all this is known to you by now.

The will and codicil of Mary Spicer Anger's father John Anger of 1837 (it's quite long, and Mary wife of Richard Belcher is only mentioned near the end of the main will), are both signed by a John Spicer of Bishopstone, Wiltshire.

On 10 January 1779 a John Angell off Little Hinton, Wiltshire married Elizabeth Spicer at Bishopstone.  I suspect that despite the slightly different name, these are Mary Spicer Anger's parents.

Lawrence and Elizabeth Spicer have a son named Moses baptised at Stanford-in-the-Vale 23 January 1714/15.

There is a Moses Spicer buried at Bishopstone 1778. His will mentions an unmarried daughter named Elizabeth.  (Haven't found a baptism of Elizabeth)
 
John and Mary Anger have a son named Moses.

[ribbo39]

Hi Galium,

Many thanks for this info.

You mention John Angell/Elizabeth Spicer marriage in 1779. Could you say where you got this record from, please?
I've looked thru the original registers for both Bishopstsone's but could find them.

added; OK I just found them.  Apparantly I was stuck in the wrong Bishopstone!!

Alan