Marraige cert for John Grogan/ Annie healy dublin 1922

[Ladyhawk]

Thanks Kiltaglassan for posting details of where to obtain the m/c 

I was having trouble with my internet connection so could not post the details - have only now been reconnected!

You can also order m/c from the Lancashire BMD link I gave but I do not know how much they charge for certificates.
GRO certifcates cost £11.00 standard delivery - you do need to register first (which is free).

[Ladyhawk]

Thomas Christopher Grogan, b. 15 Dec 1922, died Bradford, 1995.

Could this be the 1st son?

To the earlier reply you are correct

15th Dec 1922.    100% correct

Thomas Christopher Grogan of 50 Prune Park Lane Allerton Bradford died 28 Oct 1995
Administration with Will Probate 16 Nov 1995

possible marriage

Thomas C Grogan  to E Walsh  1963 Bradford volume   2b Page number   444

[Mgrogan]

Ladybank

I am very grateful to you.

I managed eventually to register with
With GRO.  And requested  cert

Unfortunately I have to wait nearly 3 weeks before I receive it ti confirm that I am correct.

In my original post I gave the name Annie , 
But she in fact used the correct name which was on marraige cert.  That of Mary ann

Everything tells me this is the one....

What are the chances of 2 identical names in the correct time frame

Must be them...but I cannot confirm yet.

They had no connection with Manchester...

In Dublin at that time. Civil War. etc
And I understand John may have left home on bad terms

So a trip to Manchester  Reg Office in

April 1922.  With first son born 15 Dec 1922. All seems to tally

I have convinced myself

I will post as soon as I hear anything back from GRO

I think we have unlocked a 98 year secret. ..  which is incredible.

Thank you for all your help

Michael

[Maiden Stone]

They had no connection with Manchester...

In Dublin at that time. Civil War. etc
And I understand John may have left home on bad terms

So a trip to Manchester  Reg Office in

April 1922.  With first son born 15 Dec 1922. All seems to tally

The wedding may have been at a Catholic church in Manchester. The words "Manchester Registry Office or Registrar Attended" in the marriage index on Lancashire BMD, posted by Ladyhawk (reply 7) means that either the marriage was at a registry office or a registrar went to attend the wedding at a church which wasn't Church of England. Catholic priests and Non-Conformist ministers in England weren't automatically wedding registrars like C. of E. clergy were. A Catholic wedding ceremony was only legally valid if a registrar was in attendance to witness it and oversee the register signing. Catholic clergy were allowed to apply to become marriage registrars from late 19th or early 20th centuries but they were slow to take it up.
John or Annie may have had relatives or friends in Manchester or they may have gone there for work.
My own Irish family went back & forth across the Irish Sea, between Lancashire and Mayo c.1900, depending on work and family considerations, thanks to cheap & efficient rail and sea transport. They had babies in both countries. 

[Mgrogan]

Reply to Maidenstone

Thank you for taking time to repky and provide your invaluable knowledge to this issue.

I have requested the marraige cert
to confirm that I have the right people. But  unfortunately I must wait 15 working g days to receive.

I note your comments and the registrar which is very interesting

And the timing as best I know all tallies perfectly.

I was thinking last night that at that time. IrL. was ( and still is)
a terrible backward country

I believe that women had to give up their jobs when they married

Annie was a School teacher. So it could well be that their wedding was on the QT  for that and other reasons.

I am confident that we are on the mobey here.

Thank you

[Maiden Stone]

And the timing as best I know all tallies perfectly.

I was thinking last night that at that time. IrL. was ( and still is)
a terrible backward country

I believe that women had to give up their jobs when they married

Annie was a School teacher. So it could well be that their wedding was on the QT  for that and other reasons.

Professional women in England, teachers, nurses, civil servants were required to give up their jobs on marriage then. On the other hand, there was a long tradition of married women working in mills in Lancashire.
There was a recession and high unemployment in Britain from early 1920s onwards. John may have gone to Manchester for a temporary job and then returned to Ireland. All men over 21 could vote from 1918 so if John was in Manchester when voter registration was happening he could have been on the electoral roll.