Author Topic: John William Newman/Edmund Newman c1820s  (Read 1489 times)

Offline ColC

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Re: John William Newman/Edmund Newman c1820s
« Reply #9 on: Wednesday 23 September 20 10:54 BST (UK) »
I think the main connection to this family is the reference to Waterman in your first post. I have references in my own ancestry where middle names have been added, I do not think that is unusual.

marriage age of 15 was legal in the day but I suspect the death year of birth was a guess.
No baptism for Ann, the name Shepstone/Shipstone does appear in the midlands & north of  England.

Possible baptism for Edmund.

Edmond Newman
Baptism Date:   25 Dec 1794
Baptism Place:   West Ham, All Saints, Essex, England
Father:   Jno. Newman
Mother:   Mary Newman

I think the children are there but as they are probably servants it might be difficult to distinguish their beginnings. Marriage records might name their father, if they remember him?

Colin
Clarke, Trickett, Orton, Lawless, Norton, Detheridge, Kirby, Goodfellow, Wagstaff, Lowe, etc.

Offline jonw65

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Re: John William Newman/Edmund Newman c1820s
« Reply #10 on: Wednesday 23 September 20 11:10 BST (UK) »
I wonder if the mother could have married at 15? 

As an alternative, why not Edmund Newman and Ann Bradshaw, 5 May 1822, St Mary Newington
Image
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-C9BG-B9Q1-2

Don't seem to be any baptisms following down there, perhaps it was more discreet for Edmund and Ann to marry south of the Thames if she was (heavily) pregnant?

Offline ColC

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Re: John William Newman/Edmund Newman c1820s
« Reply #11 on: Wednesday 23 September 20 11:13 BST (UK) »
Edmund Newman
Record Type:   Marriage
Marriage Date:   25 Dec 1856
Marriage Place:   St John of Jerusalem, South Hackney, Hackney, England
Father:   Edmund Newman a Waterman
Spouse:   Jane Theresa Wilkinson

Colin
Clarke, Trickett, Orton, Lawless, Norton, Detheridge, Kirby, Goodfellow, Wagstaff, Lowe, etc.

Offline jonw65

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Re: John William Newman/Edmund Newman c1820s
« Reply #12 on: Wednesday 23 September 20 11:34 BST (UK) »
Name:   Edmund Newman
Record Type:   Banns (Bann)
Marriage Banns Date:   6 Nov 1815
Marriage Banns Place:   All Saints, Edmonton, Enfield, Middlesex
Spouse:   Ann Shepstone??

Going back to the marriage that ColC favours, just to note that the above record is indeed from the banns register, the actual marriage was the following day (7th Nov)


Offline ColC

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Re: John William Newman/Edmund Newman c1820s
« Reply #13 on: Wednesday 23 September 20 11:57 BST (UK) »
Did the marriage record confirm Ann's name?

Colin
Clarke, Trickett, Orton, Lawless, Norton, Detheridge, Kirby, Goodfellow, Wagstaff, Lowe, etc.

Offline jonw65

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Re: John William Newman/Edmund Newman c1820s
« Reply #14 on: Wednesday 23 September 20 12:03 BST (UK) »
Well it was originally written as Shipton, but crossed out for Shepstone
A note at the foot by Dawson Warren, the vicar
The above name altered to Shepstone at the time

Ditto on the banns record where it says "altered to Shepstone at the time of Marriage"

They were bachelor and spinster, both of the parish.

Offline Bitzer1

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Re: John William Newman/Edmund Newman c1820s
« Reply #15 on: Wednesday 23 September 20 16:36 BST (UK) »
Many thanks Colin and jonw65 for your ideas and suggestions, which all seem feasible to me.  I have tried following them up but have been unable to establish any definite links with the little information I have about Edmund Newman and John William Newman.  It's difficult, of course, with such common names.  Jane Theresa Wilkinson was a servant in St Mary Stratford le Bow in the 1851 census, which is about the right area if the Edmund Newman she married in 1856 was the son of Edmund and brother of John William.

Offline ColC

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Re: John William Newman/Edmund Newman c1820s
« Reply #16 on: Wednesday 23 September 20 16:45 BST (UK) »
Looking again at the 1828 baptism transcribed Edward, I think it is Edmund.

Colin
Clarke, Trickett, Orton, Lawless, Norton, Detheridge, Kirby, Goodfellow, Wagstaff, Lowe, etc.

Offline Bitzer1

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Re: John William Newman/Edmund Newman c1820s
« Reply #17 on: Tuesday 17 November 20 12:59 GMT (UK) »
I agree that the 1828 baptism is Edmund Newman, and I have traced his family after his 1856 marriage to Jane Theresa Wilkinson, although I lost track of their son John Edmund Newman, born in 1863 in Poplar, after the 1881 census. 

I can confirm that Ann Newman of Old Ford Bow, who died in 1842, was the widow of Edmund Newman, bargeman, so that fits.  The informant Elizabeth Spencer (?) is not obviously related.  Unfortunately, I have yet to find Ann Newman or her children in the 1841 census.  I have also not been able to find out what happened to her children William and Ann.

William Newman might have married Sophia Newman on 13 June 1852 in Bethnal Green.  His father is listed as Edward Newman, Lighterman, so the wrong first name and not listed as deceased either.