Hogg's and Murder Trial of Thomas Hogg 1851

[DudelsackHogg]

First post here. Great website with lots of links for me to follow up. So thank you.

I seem to be from the black sheep side of the Hogg family. On one side there is the Poets, Reverends, Majors etc and on my side the poachers, alcoholics and murder suspects. Well.

I have be using Ancestry, FindMyPast and Scotland’s People to piece together my tree but I have hit a wall. I am new to this and would appreciate your help.

I came across a couple of news articles about a murder trial and I was hoping it might lead to some more information regarding my family.


1851 Trial

Articles from the:

Kelso Chronicle 13 June 1851 -page 6 and 7
Edinburgh Evening Courant 10 June 1851


Trial of Thomas Hogg for Murder.
The High Court of Justiciary, Edinburgh

Thomas Hogg - Accused
Agnes Hogg (Laidlaw) - Victim

“Thomas Hogg was placed at the bar charged with the crime, in so far as (in terms of the indictment) on the 12th day of February 1851, in or near the house called the Boat-House, in the parish and county of Roxburgh, then occupied by him, he did wickedly and feloniously attack and assault the now deceased Agnes Laidlaw or Hogg, his wife, and did with his hands, or with some kind of ligature, violently compress the throat, or did press it against some piece of furniture, or other hard substance to the prosecutor unknown, and did thus strangle and suffocate the said Agnes Laidlaw or Hogg, in consequence whereof she soon thereafter died, and was thus murdered by the said Thomas Hogg.
The prisoner pleaded not guilty; and a Jury having been empanelled, the case went to trial.”

Three day drinking binge. Agnes fracture of the larynx, suggested strangulation. Accused admits to hitting his wife on occasion.

Found not guilty.

Key names that appear in the article. Witnesses who gave evidence:


Elizabeth Hogg or Yeoman - Also referred to Betty Yeoman (Hogg) and Betsy  - First cousin of the accused. Also lives adjoining the Boathouse - next door.
Betsy Legget - 12 years of age - niece of the prisoner - has lived in the house since she was 5
Grace Laidlaw - sister of the deceased. Servant at Spylaw.
John Hogg - joiner in Roxburgh - Am a relation of the accused.

I have pdf’s of both articles if anyone wants me to send them. The Kelso Chronicle is a bit more balanced and the Edinburgh Evening Courant reads like Thomas got away with murder.



My possible connection to this story.


Andrew Hogg 29.10.1776 - (unverified - not found on Scotlands people)

Ancestry gives me the following information for Andrew Hogg:
Birth date: 29.10.1776
Baptism Date: 01.12.1776
Baptism place: Associate Congregation OR Free Church Jedburgh, Roxburgh
Father: Andrew Hogg
Mother: Elspeth Thomson
FHL Film number: 559522
Reference ID: 2:18NPW7M

I cannot find him on Scotlands people. How accurate is the Ancestry information? And how can I follow this up and verify the information given.

Married:

Elisabeth Davidson 30.07.1777 (birth date assumption based on only record on Scotland’s people)

They had 3 Children:

William Hogg b 20.06.1809 d 25.02.1890 (my direct descendant)
Elisabeth Hogg b 26.11.1810
Elspeth Hogg b 18.01.1813 d 29.04.1896



The 1841 Census
House Name: Boathouse

Janet Hogg 80 Birth year 1761 Roxburghshire Sp dealer
Thomas Hogg 36 Birth year 1805 Roxburghshire Labourer
Elizabeth Hogg 30 Birth year 1811 Roxburghshire F Servant
(No relationships listed)


Title Trial papers relating to Thomas Hogg
Name Thomas Hogg
Role Accused
Designation married
Age 49
Approx Birth Year 1802
Crime Murder
Crime Location the "Boathouse", Roxburgh
Trial Date 16 April 1851
Trial Location Jedburgh
Verdict Not called
NRS Reference JC26/1851/184
Notes
Case remitted to the High Court, Edinburgh (see JC26/1851/547).


I assume the Thomas in 1841 census is the same as the accused. I have not found a marriage Thomas Hogg/Agnes Laidlaw. I could buy a copy of the trial papers and minutes but it costs £45.00. Does anyone have experience purchasing such information? Is it likely to give family details - parents of the accused etc. I am quite tempted as I am already quite invested in the story.

I would like to find out. If the Elizabeth Hogg residing at the boathouse in 1841 is the daughter (born 1810) of Andrew Hogg and Elisabeth Davidson. I have looked for marriage records for Hogg / Yeoman but can’t find anything.

Any additional information on Janet Hogg also residing at the boathouse in 1841 - possibly the grandmother of Thomas and likely to be the sister of Andrew Hogg. Also, any idea what Sp dealer is?

I also cannot find any further mention of Elizabeth Hogg (1810) - death certificate/marriage etc so any pointers would be great.

It may well not be connected at all. I am working on the assumption that the Elizabeths are the same.

And finally any additional information on Andrew Hogg - if the ancestry information is accurate and why it is not on Scotland’s People (user error)?

I’ll post updates of any progress.

Thanks for your help.

[ev]

Hi , welcome to RC 

Thomas Hogg , 1851 & 1861 -
https://www.scottishindexes.com/51transcript.aspx?houseid=79209002
https://www.scottishindexes.com/61transcript.aspx?houseid=80302025

Have you looked for a death cert. for Thomas Hogg ?

Janet Hogg 80 , noted as spirit dealer on 1841 Census transcription at FreeCEN.
You would need to look at the original to verify.


ev

Added-
Betsy Legget-
https://www.scottishindexes.com/51transcript.aspx?houseid=80302030
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XTN6-NBF ?

Elizabeth Hogg or Yeoman ?
https://www.scottishindexes.com/51transcript.aspx?houseid=80302029

[DudelsackHogg]

Thanks for the fast reply. And for the links - I haven't heard of FreeCEN, found the entry. Great resource and that answers that question.

I did find a death certificate that matches but it didn't get me much further.

District of Jedburgh in the county of Roxburgh
Thomas Hogg
29th September 1877 - age 74 years.
Name of father Thomas Hogg - Shepherd
Name of mother Margaret Hogg (Young)
Informant John Neil (difficult to read - could even be Reid ) - Nephew in law

Thomas Hogg and Margaret Young were married in Eckford 16.02.1798

On a side note - after every entry on that List of Marriages 1797 page it says "Given to the poor". Does anyone know what that means? I assume the Church suggests a donation.


Thanks again.

[DudelsackHogg]

Fantastic. Good work.

So it would seem that Elizabeth Hogg from the 1841 Census is not the one giving evidence at the trial.
Elizabeth Hogg/Yeoman (the spelling from the newspaper) was born around 1831.

I'm really glad I posted here.

[Forfarian]

Andrew Hogg 29.10.1776 - (unverified - not found on Scotlands people)
Ancestry gives me the following information for Andrew Hogg:
Birth date: 29.10.1776
Baptism Date: 01.12.1776
Baptism place: Associate Congregation OR Free Church Jedburgh, Roxburgh
Father: Andrew Hogg
Mother: Elspeth Thomson
FHL Film number: 559522
Reference ID: 2:18NPW7M
I cannot find him on Scotlands people. How accurate is the Ancestry information? And how can I follow this up and verify the information given.

Never trust anything you find online, especially on Ancestry, MyHeritage and similar commercial web sites unless it is an image of an original document - and even then be wary.

I think it is an indexing omission by SP because the original is in fact there on SP. I looked for other baptisms in 1776 in the Jedburgh Associate Register, and viewed the baptism of Hellene Cook on 27 October 1776. Sure enough, Andrew's baptism is there, a few lines further down. See attachment. You owe me six credits

Elisabeth Davidson 30.07.1777 (birth date assumption based on only record on Scotland’s people)

Never make that assumption. It could be the right person but there could be another Elizabeth Davidson whose baptism record, if it ever existed, has not survived.  It looks like a reasonable working hypothesis but you need to find additional evidence to confirm it.

The 1841 Census
House Name: Boathouse
Janet Hogg 80 Birth year 1761 Roxburghshire Sp dealer
Thomas Hogg 36 Birth year 1805 Roxburghshire Labourer
Elizabeth Hogg 30 Birth year 1811 Roxburghshire F Servant
(No relationships listed)

Relationships are never listed in the 1841 census.

Also, in the 1841 census adults' ages are supposed to be rounded down to the nearest five years. So for example Janet, aged 80, could be any age from 80 to 84, and as the 1841 census was taken on 7 June, and assuming that her age is accurate, she would have been born any time between 8 June 1766 and 7 June 1771. Similarly Elizabeth Hogg, age recorded as 30, could have been born any time between 8 June 1806 and 7 June 1811, assuming that her age is accurate. The original UK census never gives a year of birth. Transcription web sites that subtract the age from the census year do you a disservice because it gives the wrong year more often than the right year.

any idea what Sp dealer is?

Spirit dealer, i.e. seller of whisky and probably gin.

[Forfarian]

On a side note - after every entry on that List of Marriages 1797 page it says "Given to the poor". Does anyone know what that means? I assume the Church suggests a donation.

The kirk charged a fee for proclaiming a couple's banns, and the money went into the fund for looking after the poor of the parish.

[Forfarian]

in the 1851 census, not surprisingly, Thomas Hogg, 49, widower, fishmonger, born Roxburghshire, Roxburgh, is recorded in Jedburgh Prison.

In 1861 he is a labourer, widower, aged 59, born Roxburgh, living alone in the Boathouse.

[DudelsackHogg]

Forfarian.

Thank you so much for looking up the baptism record. I really can't thank you enough. If I can return the favour and look something up for you I'd be more than happy to.

I certainly don't want to make assumptions, which is why this missing record was bugging me.

Thank you also for the extra information. I probably should also read the beginners board thoroughly-not just skim it.

Have a good night everyone.

[Sunlaws]

Hi
I am struggling to see any connection between your Andrew Hogg and Tommy Hogg, boatman of Roxburgh Boathouse, though the story is fascinating. Thomas Hogg died in 1866, and his parents are named as George Hogg, fisherman and Janet Hogg, née Atchiston. Just in case you do find a connection, here is Tommy, photographed by the young ladies of Sunlaws House in the 1850s, and the boathouse demolished not long after his death as the ferry boat was redundant since the coming of the railway and the footbridge attached to the railway viaduct so the people of Heiton no longer needed the services of a ferryman to get to church on Sundays.