England Briefing On TV at 5pm and Commons Statement this Evening

[mazi]

Round and round in circles we go, how about this, we have an experimental vaccine, it produces antibodies and, for the technically minded, killer T cells.

It is wandering round all the red tape and regulations.

Why not use it tomorrow, starting with over 80s and then the most vulnerable.

It may not work at all, but there is nothing to lose, if it is is only 50% successful it would solve the problem.

It has not killed anyone yet, nor caused serious side effects.

I repeat we have nothing to lose by it.

Mike

[josey]

No wonder in October a City had 9 million people tested in 5 days. Makes me wonder how a country has such huge facilities?

Not huge facilities but a different approach 'pooled testing'. In China batches of 10 or 20 swabs were tested as one, if the batch came out positive the samples in that batch were tested individually. This approach was suggested in the UK some months ago but not taken up. Likely to be taken up soon by Germany and the US.

[Rena]

I'm retired, but I would definitely be sacking any of my workers who by their deliberate actions endangered the lives of others

What would you do with the employers whose actions endanger the lives of others?

I don't feel sorry for anyone who puts the wellbeing of others firmly at the back of their mind just so they can enjoy themselves.

Usually self employed and owners of small companies are working all hours God sends, thus might not have time for pleasures..  I suppose, they could have been the ones who had sufficient money in their back pockets to drive up to 500 miles to the seaside.- - thus introducing the virus into places that had escaped the scourge.

We've discovered many carriers don't know who they've been in contact with

If the police had been taking every partygoer's name, we would have future reference so that we could hit them where it hurt = their pockets.

I might not be so harsh if I had not been the victim of several cancelled medical appointments due to lockdowns over several months .

I am referring to employers who do not take action to make a secure, safe environment for their workers, not people who attend parties etc.
You would sack workers who deliberately endanger the lives of others. I just wondered about the employers.

Within any industry, word gets around and I can invisage that if it came to light that  suppliers in an industry weren't playing by the book, then that supplier would find his order books getting very thin.

[Viktoria]

We seem to be a Nation of two halves, those who respect the rules as much as is humanly possible and those who have no intention of respecting the rules.
How to get the second half to see sense is the huge problem .
It strikes me that  they have no inner resources ,can’t face being alone for even the shortest time .
But with all the gadgets they have and are so fond of using they are in many ways better equipped to cope with restrictions in their social lives than the other end of the spectrum.
Young people are natural gatherers ,need to be in groups etc ,that secret “clique “ that means no entry for parents .
But they think they are old enough for all sorts of things ,yet seem unable to
think about risk minimising , do they think they are invincible?
Sadly of course they are not .
In their defence  many adults are just as bad or worse because they ought to be wiser, and their attitude is that they don’t want to be inconvenienced .
Life must go on as normal for them.
We really need a big “ Wake Up “ call.
Watching the announcement yesterday, am I stupid or were the graphs etc
on screen always pertinent to what was being said?
On my modest TV half of the graphs were not on screen,I kept looking on the floor to see if they had fallen down!
I felt someone was trying to blind me with science.
A lot was said but not much substance to it.
Draconian measures are needed and anyone breaking the rules should be deemed an enemy of the people,I know that is a quote —— but that is exactly what they are ,putting others at risk through their selfish actions.
We have got to get tough, the soft approach has not worked.
All the money already poured into this has been wasted by lifting lockdown
far too soon , allowing universities to accept students, foreign holidays and selfish people who went in  the  first place rushing back to avoid the quarantine which started on a set date .
Did one day less mean those returning early were not infected.?
Pussy footing , and what a mess we are in because of it
Some people will always flout rules ,too hard and some won’t obey, too soft and not seen as really important .
What this says about us as a nation - because the rule breakers get more
publicity !
No one reports on all the little old ladies and gentlemen, obeying the rules exactly .Trying not to inconvenience their families ,seeing no one they love ,
just getting a phone call and for many not even emails.
Worrying about those in their family who have worked hard and been successful in business ventures and are now responsible for the livelihoods of their employees .
Thinking how this affects students and scholars ,our scientists and Doctors ,Nurses etc of the future.

It is a circle that gets ever wider ,so when will the selfish irresponsible ones
realise that whether they like it or not they are in it ,and they had better start
behaving as if they are ,or else!

It really is time to get tough ,very tough !
Literally - our lives depend on it .
Viktoria.

[Romilly]

Victoria, - neither my husband or myself could read those graphs.

Not even with glasses on... They were too small, and completely indecipherable, - to us anyway!

Romilly.

[Mike in Cumbria]

Although the reports of big house parties, pub crawls etc make good television, the data seems to show that the vast majority of the increase in cases comes from normal human behaviour - people going to work, visiting family, shopping, eating out etc. When these activities were restricted in lockdown v1, the cases dropped, only to rise again when the restrictions were lifted.
It's annoying to see people blatantly ignoring the rules, but the evidence suggests that that isn't the main problem.
There aren't any easy answers.

[BushInn1746]

Round and round in circles we go, how about this, we have an experimental vaccine, it produces antibodies and, for the technically minded, killer T cells.

It is wandering round all the red tape and regulations.

SARS-CoV-2 also goes for the ACE2 (Angiotensin-converting enzyme 2) Receptor, looking at Reports submitted to American Libraries.
 ----------
It seems our Human Immune System needs to make an appropriate response to the invader and apparently it is not in some cases.

Too many Cytokines (Cytokine Storm) leads to complications.
 ----------
Thank you Josey regarding mass testing.

Mark

[Guy Etchells]

Although the reports of big house parties, pub crawls etc make good television, the data seems to show that the vast majority of the increase in cases comes from normal human behaviour - people going to work, visiting family, shopping, eating out etc. When these activities were restricted in lockdown v1, the cases dropped, only to rise again when the restrictions were lifted.
It's annoying to see people blatantly ignoring the rules, but the evidence suggests that that isn't the main problem.
There aren't any easy answers.

I don't think the evidence is granular enough to show such trends
Cheers
Guy

[Maiden Stone]

Mark - your reply about the spread via travel - in my opinion - hits the nail on the head.

I have long been of the opinion that once earlier restrictions were lifted & people were allowed to travel abroad - we would see an increase. 

Back in September I was told of a young woman who went to Spain for a week with 5 friends.  3 days after her return she tested positive for Covid but in that time how many others were potential victims?   All the people on her flight plus those she socialised with in the 3 days after her return?

A recent study, not yet peer-reviewed, has found that 80% of cases in Scotland and Wales and 50%   in England in mid-September were variant 20A.EU1. It's been traced to agricultural workers in Spain  who spread it to the general population in Spain in June and July. One of the lead scientists who conducted the study was interviewed on "Today", BBC Radio 4 this week. There are reports in various media.