Joseph Lee Same signature?

[mcadamsd]

Trying to find relatives of a Sarah Lee related to this post https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=840399.0

Based on some of the feedback, I found an "allegation" 28 Dec 1799 at St Andrew Holborn, Middlesex.

It appears that Joseph Lee signed the document.  He also signed the marriage Bann from 1798 for the Sarah Lee that I am looking for.

Do the attached signatures appear to be by the same person?

[Annie65115]

I'm no expert but I'd say not,especially if there was only 1 year separating them.

[ShaunJ]

Well I would say that they are very similar! Almost identical. The upward slope of Joseph and the lower start of Lee are very distinctive.

[Neale1961]

I think they are similar, when you compare the shaping of the letters.

[Ruskie]

I don’t think they are written by the same person. Though there are similarities they may be due to how writing was taught and the “rules” followed.

The angle of the word Joseph is the only similarity I think. Unsure if that is the clincher though. 

Differences:
The curve of the J
The loop of the o
Gap between the s and the e in Joseph
Tail of the p
Loop of the riser of h and tail of h
Top loop of L in Lee and the loop after the downstroke
Both es

In addition, the top hand is a lot more confident.

However you do need to consider what the documents were and if he may have taken more care over a signature on an official document. 

[wivenhoe]

Another opinion -

I do not think they are signatures of the same person. The way that the writer uses the pen is different.....as already noted.

The first signature has continuous writing.

The second signature has the pen leaving and returning to the paper....the gaps between the letters.

               .......Jos ep h Lee.........

I think that mannerism is more likely to be consistent through life.

[majm]

I think these are Two different hands...., both right handed, so two different people.  I agree with Ruskie and with Wivenhoe and Annie.  The prevailing style often turns up similar shaped letters, but those aspects and features ...gaps ... that Wivenhoe mentions can be unique to an individual.   

JM

[arthurk]

I think sometimes too much can be made of any apparent differences between signatures.

The circumstances in which something was signed can have quite an effect on letter formation: if you sign your name when sitting at a desk, then (to replicate the layout of some church vestries etc) standing leaning over the desk, and again on something about chest height, and maybe squashed into a corner with no elbow room, you're going to see some differences.

Then there's the variability of pen nibs in those days, and the pen sometimes needing more ink in the middle of a word...

As for these two, I did at first think they were by different people, but now I'm not so sure.

[Watson]

I would say the two signatures are, overall, pretty similar and that there is a very good chance they were by the same person.  One should not expect them to be identical in every respect.