Mary Moore, born c1802 at Girthon

[bigt]

Hi Gadget,

The problem I have is that, according to a contact I have who is into genetics DNA, the common ancestors should be my matches 2x great grandparents, who are John Bailiff and Agnes Henry, both born at Gatehouse min the 1830's.  Give or take a generation. I have no links with Ireland. So, using John and Agnes as a starting point, my main target is Mary Muir as the Henry family has been researched.  My initial thought was "someone has been naughty" :-)  I will have to see if I can trace a descendant of James and Mary to see if they perhaps match.  As mentioned, 3 other descendants of John and Agnes match me also.  Interesting one.

Tom

[Gadget]

I like a DNA puzzle!

What cMs do you share with the 5 matches - and do they 'triangulate' - i.e match each other and you?

Don't take much notice of the ethnicities that the site gives you. They're getting better but still a side line. Concentrate on the amount of  shared cMs.

Is this Ancestry?  It would be really best to get the data loaded onto a site that has a chromosome browser - Gedmatch, My heritage, for e.g.

Gadget

[MonicaL]

Tom, I think James Snr had a brother Samuel also living with his family in Girthon. 1851 entry for him here www.scottishindexes.com/51transcript.aspx?houseid=86606013

Thought it might help in case similar names cross over when you are looking at the next generation down, so you can be aware that there looks to be two connected families in Girthon.

Also adding this in case you haven't come across it in regards to John and wife Agnes www.hainings.net/2/35596.htm

Monica

[bigt]

Thanks Monica,  Samuel was also at Borgue. I have the family noted just in case they are needed.

As for the shared cM.  2 are on MyHeritage and 3 on Ancestry.

The MyHeritage ones are either 3rd cousins or half 3rd cousins to each other.  The reason the half is mentioned is the great grandfather on one was born 4 years before his parents got married.  He was born 1858 and his parents married in 1862.  His birth record has the surname Henry, but in 1861 his surname is Bailiff.  I therefore assume it was the same father, but father's name is not mentioned.

Anyway, the 2 matches are 3-4th cousin to me. 
One shares 61.6cM over 3 segments, largest 33.3cM.  This match doesn't show on my brother's DNA.

Other shares 66.6cM over 3 segments, largest 25.1cM.  This one matches my brother, 61.8cM over 4 segments, largest 22.5

The 3 of us share 1 triangulated segment on Chromosome 9.  20.5cM
I'll send another message with details of the Ancestry matches.

Tom

[hmcc]

Girthon Kirk Session Ist July 1827, Elizabeth Fell is with child and James Bailiff, (hedger) acknowledges he is the father.
http://www.gatehouse-folk.org.uk/userfiles/files/Girthon%20Kirk%20Session%20Notes/Girthon%20Kirk%20Session%20Notes%201821%20to%201829.pdf

hmcc

[bigt]

Regarding my Ancestry matches.

The 3 come up as 5-8th cousin

Me.
One matches 20cM over 2 segments
One matches 16cM over 1 segment
One matches 19cM over 1 segment

My brother.
One matches 32cM over 2 segments
One matches 26cM over 2 segments
One matches 26cM over 3 segments.

I have sent messages to these people but no reply.

All 5 are 2x great grandchildren to Agnes Henry/John Bailiff
One is descended from their son James (b1862)
The rest descended from John Henry Bailiff, (b1858)

Think that's it.

Tom

Tom

[bigt]

Thanks hmcc, must have missed that one.
Tom

[Gadget]

Do they have any linked  trees?

Re the MyH match:

shares 66.6cM over 3 segments, largest 25.1cM.  This one matches my brother, 61.8cM over 4 segments, largest 22.5

The 3 of us share 1 triangulated segment on Chromosome 9.  20.5cM

Have you been in touch?

https://dnapainter.com/tools/sharedcmv4  gives a reasonably close relationship.

[bigt]

Hi Gadget,

I have been in touch with one of the 2 matches on MyHeritage.  No reply from the other.  The one I have been in touch with had done a lot of research and gave me the details.  I checked it all myself except for recent stuff that's not available and looks correct.
The one I have been in touch with matches 61.6cM.  The person has a tree on Ancestry and MyHeritage.  I've not seen the tree but gave me details of each generation.
Tom