Author Topic: Louisa SOUTHALL of Dudley marriages 1849 and 1856  (Read 240 times)

Offline ColC

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Re: Louisa SOUTHALL of Dudley marriages 1849 and 1856
« Reply #9 on: Wednesday 16 December 20 11:07 GMT (UK) »
   BOURNE, LOUISA       0 
GRO Reference: 1853  M Quarter in STOURBRIDGE  Volume 06C  Page 92

I knew there was another reason why I discounted it.

I guess this is Louisa father William a labourer.

Louisa SOUTHALL   Baptism   30 Sep 1832   Worcestershire   Dudley : St Thomas :

Colin
Clarke, Trickett, Orton, Lawless, Norton, Detheridge, Kirby, Goodfellow, Wagstaff, Lowe, etc.

Offline imarlb

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Re: Louisa SOUTHALL of Dudley marriages 1849 and 1856
« Reply #10 on: Wednesday 16 December 20 11:41 GMT (UK) »
Yes, Colin. You were right to discount that death. The GRO has her age as 0 so an infant death and not the one I wanted. There are 3 baptisms on FreeREG. There's Joseph BOURNE born 22 Mar 1853, Mary Ann BROWN born Nov 1854 and Maria BOURNE born 28 Nov 1856. There are matching birth registrations but Maria BOURNE's MMN is STANLEY and not CROSS. There is a birth registration for Mary Alice CROSS MMN STANLEY in Dudley in 1854. So Enoch's wife Mary Ann was a widow. In 1861, Mary Alice is with them but no sign of Louisa's children Joseph and Mary Ann. Unless you count Mary Ann WEBB with Louisa and Joseph aged 6 in 1861. There isn't a suitable birth registration for this child with surname WEBB in Dudley in 1854. It certainly is a tangled web and I'm not sure where we stand at the moment but I'm definitely leaning towards a practical solution to marriage breakdown in the absence of divorce.
It's interesting stuff. Thanks for your help.
Irene

Offline ColC

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Re: Louisa SOUTHALL of Dudley marriages 1849 and 1856
« Reply #11 on: Wednesday 16 December 20 18:10 GMT (UK) »

Well the GRO seems to identify Louisa, so my guess is that is correct

BOURNE, JOSEPH       SOUTHALL 
GRO Reference: 1853  M Quarter in DUDLEY  Volume 06C  Page 125


BOURNE, MARY  ANN     SOUTHALL 
GRO Reference: 1854  S Quarter in DUDLEY  Volume 06C  Page 127


An Enoch Brown married Ann Corby 1846 Dudley but I do not see any children born there?

Enoch Bourn married Louisa 1849

1851 – Old Mill St. Dudley, as Transcribed

Enoch Bowin 30Louisa Bowin 20 Tailor & Tailoress

So did Enoch die, or did they divorce?


Colin
Clarke, Trickett, Orton, Lawless, Norton, Detheridge, Kirby, Goodfellow, Wagstaff, Lowe, etc.


Offline imarlb

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Re: Louisa SOUTHALL of Dudley marriages 1849 and 1856
« Reply #12 on: Thursday 17 December 20 11:14 GMT (UK) »
Hi Colin:
My best guess is that neither Louisa nor Enoch died. Divorce was not an option. So they quietly married again and either nobody noticed or there was sufficient tolerance for this kind of thing. Enoch married Mary Ann Cross and Louisa married Joseph Webb who may have been a cousin. It's possible that Louisa's mother was Sarah Webb.
Best wishes, Irene

Offline ColC

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Re: Louisa SOUTHALL of Dudley marriages 1849 and 1856
« Reply #13 on: Thursday 17 December 20 11:19 GMT (UK) »
Hi Irene,
I have managed to find more information on Enoch.

I note the marriage you mention.
Enoch Bourn
Spouse   Mary Ann Cross Or Stanley
Marriage   20 Feb 1856 Old Swinford, Worcestershire

Old Swinford, near Stourbridge, 5 miles to Dudley, 12 miles to Redditch.

CROSS, MARY  ALICE     STANLEY 
GRO Reference: 1854  D Quarter in DUDLEY  Volume 06C  Page 96

1881 –Dudley (Bourne)
Enoch Bowins   65   Journeyman Tailor born Redditch, Wocs.
Mary J. (A) Bowins    51   Born Staffs, Wordsley
Francis G. Bowins   19   Born Dudley
Richard H. Bowins   16   Born Dudley
Ann M. Bowins   13   Born Dudley
Arthur E. Leatham   6   Born Dudley
Frederick W. Leatham   3   Born Dudley

1871 –Dudley    address for 1861-1881 Tavern or Tower Street

1861 –Dudley
Enoch Bourn   44   Journeyman Tailor born Redditch, Wocs.
Mary Ann Bourn   31   Born Staffs, Wordsley
Mary Alice Cross   6   Born Dudley (on 1871 but not 1881)
Sarah Windsor   42   Lodger

So maybe this is the above Enoch Bourne died Q1/1894 age 77 Dudley

But is he the same one as the one who married Louisa?

On the 1851 census Enoch Bowin (BOURNE) noted is age as 30 (born 1821)
Louisa 20 both born Worcestershire.

1841 – Enock Bowine (BOURNE) Potters Field, Dudley, a Tailor, not with family, census age 20.
                                                     (Not born in County, ie not Worcestershire)

Both of these baptisms in the Dudley area.

Enoch BOURNE   Baptism   13 Jul 1817   Staffordshire   Brierley Hill : St Michael :
Parents William a collier Maria, abode Brockmoor

Enoch BOURNE   Baptism   21 Nov 1819   Staffordshire   Sedgley : All Saints
Parents William a miner & Hannah Ettingshall

The only one born Redditch, father Henry a needle maker & Mary
William Enoch BOURNE   Baptism   09 Jul 1815   Worcestershire   Redditch : Redditch Wesleyan Circuit

Colin
Clarke, Trickett, Orton, Lawless, Norton, Detheridge, Kirby, Goodfellow, Wagstaff, Lowe, etc.

Offline ColC

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Re: Louisa SOUTHALL of Dudley marriages 1849 and 1856
« Reply #14 on: Thursday 17 December 20 11:26 GMT (UK) »
Hi Irene,
I have managed to find more information on Enoch.

I note the marriage you mention.
Enoch Bourn
Spouse   Mary Ann Cross Or Stanley
Marriage   20 Feb 1856 Old Swinford, Worcestershire

Old Swinford, near Stourbridge, 5 miles to Dudley, 12 miles to Redditch.

CROSS, MARY  ALICE     STANLEY 
GRO Reference: 1854  D Quarter in DUDLEY  Volume 06C  Page 96

1881 –Dudley (Bourne)
Enoch Bowins   65   Journeyman Tailor born Redditch, Wocs.
Mary J. (A) Bowins    51   Born Staffs, Wordsley
Francis G. Bowins   19   Born Dudley
Richard H. Bowins   16   Born Dudley
Ann M. Bowins   13   Born Dudley
Arthur E. Leatham   6   Born Dudley
Frederick W. Leatham   3   Born Dudley

1871 –Dudley    address for 1861-1881 Tavern or Tower Street

1861 –Dudley
Enoch Bourn   44   Journeyman Tailor born Redditch, Wocs.
Mary Ann Bourn   31   Born Staffs, Wordsley
Mary Alice Cross   6   Born Dudley (on 1871 but not 1881)
Sarah Windsor   42   Lodger

So maybe this is the above Enoch Bourne died Q1/1894 age 77 Dudley

But is he the same one as the one who married Louisa?

On the 1851 census Enoch Bowin (BOURNE) noted is age as 30 (born 1821)
Louisa 20 both born Worcestershire.

1841 – Enock Bowine (BOURNE) Potters Field, Dudley, a Tailor, not with family, census age 20.
                                                     (Not born in County, ie not Worcestershire)

Both of these baptisms in the Dudley area.

Enoch BOURNE   Baptism   13 Jul 1817   Staffordshire   Brierley Hill : St Michael :
Parents William a collier Maria, abode Brockmoor

Enoch BOURNE   Baptism   21 Nov 1819   Staffordshire   Sedgley : All Saints
Parents William a miner & Hannah Ettingshall

The only one born Redditch, father Henry a needle maker & Mary
William Enoch BOURNE   Baptism   09 Jul 1815   Worcestershire   Redditch : Redditch Wesleyan Circuit

Colin
Clarke, Trickett, Orton, Lawless, Norton, Detheridge, Kirby, Goodfellow, Wagstaff, Lowe, etc.

Offline ColC

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Re: Louisa SOUTHALL of Dudley marriages 1849 and 1856
« Reply #15 on: Thursday 17 December 20 11:37 GMT (UK) »
Hi Colin:
My best guess is that neither Louisa nor Enoch died.

I think you are probably right divorce records did not begin until 1858.

Colin
Clarke, Trickett, Orton, Lawless, Norton, Detheridge, Kirby, Goodfellow, Wagstaff, Lowe, etc.