Author Topic: Cannnot decipher 1841 and 1851 census for same family  (Read 943 times)

Offline nicdigby

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Re: Cannnot decipher 1841 and 1851 census for same family
« Reply #18 on: Thursday 31 December 20 16:36 GMT (UK) »
1841 census = living with his son = says he is 50 = birth yr 1891 + Born Stoke Newington
1851 census = living with his son = age difficult to read but pp said it says 65 = birth year abt 1786 + Born Stoke Newington

Please bear in mind that in the 1841 census the ages of over 15 year olds were rounded down to the nearest 5 years. So someone showing on the census as 50 could actually be anything up to 54 years old.
See here, about half way down the page
http://freepages.rootsweb.com/~framland/history/census/1841directions.htm

There were, of course some occasions when this instruction wasn't followed.

This is fascinating, thank you. I did not know that they rounded ages down! Incredible in today's age but I guess it was a very different time to live in, where ages of people weren't as known or as vital as they are today.  I have bookmarked the page. I am realising what a great hobby this is - I've been doing it about nine months and only now am learning some crucial stuff. I've been thinking that the numbers in the "schedule" column on census records was the house number until this week as well :)

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Offline nicdigby

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Re: Cannnot decipher 1841 and 1851 census for same family
« Reply #19 on: Thursday 31 December 20 16:42 GMT (UK) »
Further to the main query, I am still trying to pin down the most likely baptism of George GREW who married in 1809.

Lizzie has PM'd me to say she's been through the Stoke Newington baptism records and he's not on there in the likely years and that often people got the locations slightly wrong anyway.

Can I have therefore please have some advice?

I don't think the info on another Anc tree is correct (baptism Bethnal Green 1797 as he would have been 10 or 11 at marriage). Unless he was baptised as an older child though, which did happen regularly.

But is most accurate baptism record is the 1784 one in Bethnal Green, do you think?

Or should I be looking elsewhere, and if so, where?

I hope I am not causing any duplication or that I have missed out a post with the correct info in it. I am a chemotherapy patient and I struggle with short-term memory sometimes as a result, so please be patient and kind  :). I am grateful for any help; this is the last little bit of my family tree project for now on this line; I want to pinpoint:

1) George's baptism
2) who his parents were
3) their marriage and children
4) any earlier links if I can get back that far.

Many thanks
Nic x

The Essex Digbys of Finchingfield/Little Sampford & Pimlico, London + Pidgeon-Howletts of Norfolk + Grews of Stoke Newington/Bethnal Green + Pearse of Hitchin, Herts + Hills of Bedfordshire and Brampton, Hunts.

Offline LizzieL

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Re: Cannnot decipher 1841 and 1851 census for same family
« Reply #20 on: Friday 01 January 21 08:47 GMT (UK) »


1841 census = living with his son = says he is 50 = birth yr 1891 + Born Stoke Newington
1851 census = living with his son = age difficult to read but pp said it says 65 = birth year abt 1786 + Born Stoke Newington
Death Reg on GRO , George Grew died in 1859 age 72 = birth year abt 1787.
GRO Reference: 1859  S Quarter in CLERKENWELL  Volume 01B  Page 354

I think the latter death record is correct because he is living with his son in 1841 and 1851 but has disappeared by the time we get to the 1861 census.


Cemetery records on Ancestry have address of the George who died in 1859 as Wilmington Place Clerkenwell, same as 1851 census.Buried 31 July.  So it is same one
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Offline KGarrad

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Re: Cannnot decipher 1841 and 1851 census for same family
« Reply #21 on: Friday 01 January 21 09:05 GMT (UK) »
1841 census = living with his son = says he is 50 = birth yr 1891 + Born Stoke Newington

Also 1841 census doesn't show place of birth?
Simply a column marked "Born in County?" to which the usual answer is Y or N.
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Offline nicdigby

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Re: Cannnot decipher 1841 and 1851 census for same family
« Reply #22 on: Friday 01 January 21 18:38 GMT (UK) »


1841 census = living with his son = says he is 50 = birth yr 1891 + Born Stoke Newington
1851 census = living with his son = age difficult to read but pp said it says 65 = birth year abt 1786 + Born Stoke Newington
Death Reg on GRO , George Grew died in 1859 age 72 = birth year abt 1787.
GRO Reference: 1859  S Quarter in CLERKENWELL  Volume 01B  Page 354

I think the latter death record is correct because he is living with his son in 1841 and 1851 but has disappeared by the time we get to the 1861 census.


Cemetery records on Ancestry have address of the George who died in 1859 as Wilmington Place Clerkenwell, same as 1851 census.Buried 31 July.  So it is same one

Thank you for this Lizzie. So we know when he died, and the death record said he was 72, so born abt 1787.

I think I have got two baptism possibiities still, and I don't know how to know which is correct and I can find nothing to help me on Anc, FindMyPast, FS or freereg.

I would dearly love some help on this point from you guys please. I can find no baptisms of note in Stoke Newington which is where the 1851 census says he was born but I have been advised by you guys that these locations and ages were often off by a few years and miles.

So I think I am left with two possible baptisms - how do I know which is the correct one please:
Baptism 1: George GREW St Matthew, Bethnal Green, Mdsx, born 19 Jan 1776 and bapt 2 Feb 1776. Fa: George, a weaver. Mo: Sarah

Baptism 2: George GREW ST Matthew, Bethnal Green, Mdsx, born 17 May 1784 and bap 30 May 1784. Fa: John (weaver), Mo: Elizabeth.

Other info I have discovered but am unsure what it signifies:

A) I think that if George Grew's father was also George, as per baptism 1 above, there is a possible marriage of a George Grew (Ancestry, London Clandestine Marriages) , a weaver, widower, in "Bedlam Green" hamlet, 24 May 1742.

B) a burial of a George Grew St Matthew's Bethnal Green 11 Mar 1777. George's father? He was baptised 1776 and his father died the next year?

Or were there two Grew families in the area? I can't make it out.

C) Family Search have a member's tree which enticingly goes back several generations from George Grew baptised Bethnal Green 1776. It states his father is George Grew born 1738 and mother Sarah Comarque born 1737, Spitalfields, London, and that they married 1766. The Comarque side goes back to France, but I don't think it's right because Jean/John Comarque has left a written will leaving everything to his cousin and a friend ie he didn't have children. Also my ancestors are weavers - I don't think they would have done wills????

The same tree states that George Grew born 1738 was born to Jonathan Grew born 19 Nov 1738, Haltwhistle, Northumberland, m 1732 Middlesex or London to Mary Parteridge born 1710.

While it would be lovely to have the tree open up in front of me like this, I'm not sure it is correct.
The Essex Digbys of Finchingfield/Little Sampford & Pimlico, London + Pidgeon-Howletts of Norfolk + Grews of Stoke Newington/Bethnal Green + Pearse of Hitchin, Herts + Hills of Bedfordshire and Brampton, Hunts.

Offline Lily M

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Re: Cannnot decipher 1841 and 1851 census for same family
« Reply #23 on: Friday 01 January 21 19:33 GMT (UK) »
Itís tempting to assume that your George Grew was the one baptised 1784 at Bethnal Green, but Iíve been unable to strengthen this by tying him to any of his possible siblings.
Iím sure there are many helpers on here who have tried to do the same thing.
I wonder if George naming his 3rd daughter Caroline Rhodes Grew might provide a clue to his family.  Iíve not been able to go back any further though.

Offline nicdigby

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Re: Cannnot decipher 1841 and 1851 census for same family
« Reply #24 on: Friday 01 January 21 19:38 GMT (UK) »
Itís tempting to assume that your George Grew was the one baptised 1784 at Bethnal Green, but Iíve been unable to strengthen this by tying him to any of his possible siblings.
Iím sure there are many helpers on here who have tried to do the same thing.
I wonder if George naming his 3rd daughter Caroline Rhodes Grew might provide a clue to his family.  Iíve not been able to go back any further though.

Thank you for trying. Yes caroline Rhodes grew is unusual, I wonder if she will help solve the puzzle
The Essex Digbys of Finchingfield/Little Sampford & Pimlico, London + Pidgeon-Howletts of Norfolk + Grews of Stoke Newington/Bethnal Green + Pearse of Hitchin, Herts + Hills of Bedfordshire and Brampton, Hunts.

Offline Gherkin6

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Re: Cannnot decipher 1841 and 1851 census for same family
« Reply #25 on: Saturday 02 January 21 11:54 GMT (UK) »
1871 census says Wenlock Street
Higgins / Higgens - Shoreditch, Clerkenwell, Rotherhithe
Storey - City of London
Munnikhuizen and varied spellings - London and Amsterdam
Clark - Portsmouth area
Pettit - Ongar, Moreton general area Essex
Duke - Flamborough, East Yorkshire
Bell - searching for unknown father of Kate Bell born 1870 Thwing, Yorkshire - possibly Coates.

Online Rosinish

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Re: Cannnot decipher 1841 and 1851 census for same family
« Reply #26 on: Saturday 02 January 21 12:43 GMT (UK) »
From reply #22

"So I think I am left with two possible baptisms - how do I know which is the correct one please:
Baptism 1: George GREW St Matthew, Bethnal Green, Mdsx, born 19 Jan 1776 and bapt 2 Feb 1776. Fa: George, a weaver. Mo: Sarah

Baptism 2: George GREW ST Matthew, Bethnal Green, Mdsx, born 17 May 1784 and bap 30 May 1784. Fa: John (weaver), Mo: Elizabeth."


Did your George name a son John?

Did your George name a daughter Sarah or Elizabeth?

Quite often a 1st son is named after his paternal g/father but where there are large families/siblings the 2nd son can often be named after the paternal g/father.

However, with common names & if on both sides it can be difficult to tell.

Annie
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