Author Topic: John Molloy (convict??)  (Read 1637 times)

Offline haney

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John Molloy (convict??)
« on: Thursday 31 December 20 22:27 GMT (UK) »
Good Morning list and a Very Happy New Year
 
   With my enquiry I am not certain if John MOLLOY is/was a convict but I am following up on a “possible” lead that he was sent here to NSW on Hercules II in 1830.  I have looked for convicts name John Molloy on the NSW State Archives and found nothing on him.

This was sent to me a while ago though for John Molloy in the NSW Australia convict + ship muster rolls and related records.  Hercules II arrival 1830. What documents/timeline for this particular John Molloy I do not have at the present.

He married HANNAH/Johanna McKenna on the Apsley Mission, Montifiores/Mudgee in 1851 and again married her in the Catholic church in Mudgee in 1864. 
 
John stated that he was a Widow on his marriage in 1864. 
On Grevilles 1872 Directory John is a Blacksmith in Mudgee
 
 
On his death certificate in Mudgee 1875 it states he was in NSW for 45 years, whether this is accurate or not??? birthplace Ireland, buried Mudgee General Cemetery.

I have just ordered the birth certificate of his last child born in Mudgee in 1873 just in case it has some relevant information as to exact birth place other than just Ireland (maybe helpful).

So if there is anyway I can find more information on the JOHN Molloy from the Hercules II to possibly include or eliminate him that would be great.  Many thanks Dianna
 





Offline majm

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Re: John Molloy (convict??)
« Reply #1 on: Thursday 31 December 20 22:52 GMT (UK) »
Good Morning list and a Very Happy New Year
 
   With my enquiry I am not certain if John MOLLOY is/was a convict but I am following up on a “possible” lead that he was sent here to NSW on Hercules II in 1830.  I have looked for convicts name John Molloy on the NSW State Archives and found nothing on him.

This was sent to me a while ago though for John Molloy in the NSW Australia convict + ship muster rolls and related records.  Hercules II arrival 1830. What documents/timeline for this particular John Molloy I do not have at the present.

He married HANNAH/Johanna McKenna on the Apsley Mission, Montifiores/Mudgee in 1851 and again married her in the Catholic church in Mudgee in 1864. 
 
John stated that he was a Widow on his marriage in 1864. 
On Grevilles 1872 Directory John is a Blacksmith in Mudgee
 
 
On his death certificate in Mudgee 1875 it states he was in NSW for 45 years, whether this is accurate or not??? birthplace Ireland, buried Mudgee General Cemetery.

I have just ordered the birth certificate of his last child born in Mudgee in 1873 just in case it has some relevant information as to exact birth place other than just Ireland (maybe helpful).

So if there is anyway I can find more information on the JOHN Molloy from the Hercules II to possibly include or eliminate him that would be great.  Many thanks Dianna

Happy New Year to you too

I think there's two chaps by that name.  One who arrived per Hercules in 1802 ...  and one who died in 1875. 

NSW did not have divorce until 1873, nd so a man would not have twice married the same wife prior to then.    Have you searched the church register for the age, place of birth, parents names, etc for the elusive blanks on NSW BDM copy of civil registration of 1864 marriage?

JM
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Offline shume

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Re: John Molloy (convict??)
« Reply #2 on: Thursday 31 December 20 22:59 GMT (UK) »
https://www.hawkesbury.net.au/claimaconvict/convictDetails.php?convictId=37257

This link is for John Molloy arr 1830 per Hercules 11
However NSW State Archives and Ancestry have at least 4 more men named John Molloy arriving c 1835.

How do you know that the man you are researching is the correct John Molloy?

shume
australia
HUME: Fermanagh, Donegal,Sligo,Australia
PASFIELD: Essex, London
SHAW/STANLEY: Co Waterford,Ireland, Australia


Offline majm

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Re: John Molloy (convict??)
« Reply #3 on: Thursday 31 December 20 23:01 GMT (UK) »
Look for John LENNON aka John McIlloy per the Hercules 1830.  He was assigned to Charles Windeyer. 

McIlloy V Molloy

JM
The information in my posts is provided for academic and non-commercial research purposes. 
Random Acts of Kindness Given Freely are never Worthless for they are Priceless.
Qui scit et non docet.    Qui docet et non vivit.    Qui nescit et non interrogat.   
All Census Look Ups Are Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Offline Neale1961

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Re: John Molloy (convict??)
« Reply #4 on: Thursday 31 December 20 23:30 GMT (UK) »
On Hercules II 1830 I can see ...
John LENNON aka mcILROY age 22 sent to WINDERMEYER for employment
And
John MOLLOY age 18 sent to ABBOTT for employment
Milligan - Jardine – Glencross – Dinwoodie - Brown: (Dumfriesshire & Kirkcudbrightshire)
Clark – Faulds – Cuthbertson – Bryson – Wilson: (Ayrshire & Renfrewshire)
Neale – Cater – Kinder - Harrison: (Warwickshire & Queensland)
Roberts - Spry: (Cornwall, Middlesex & Queensland)
Munster: (Schleswig-Holstein & Queensland) and Plate: (Braunschweig, Neubruck & Queensland)

Offline haney

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Re: John Molloy (convict??)
« Reply #5 on: Friday 01 January 21 00:08 GMT (UK) »
Hi thanks for your replies.  Firstly should I make contact with "Claim a convict" to see if this is a descendant who has claimed him already?? 

John MOLLOY was married to the same lady twice once as a Non-Catholic marriage and later in the Catholic church in Mudgee.  They may have felt that their marriage to each other was no valid unless in the Catholic church.

I feel as though I have to start this research all over again as it has not been ascertained from what I can see that the John MOLLOY who died in Mudgee in 1875 aged 68 (in NSW for 45 years!) therefore arrival in approximately 1830--could be off though, is the same man on the Hercules.

That is why I'm trying to find what information I can on him.  Both his marriage records to Hannah/Johanna McKenna are lacking the necessary details and I may have to contact the Archives office (MUDGEE for the Catholic Church) to see if anymore can be found.  Hopefully the priest asked for more details than he submitted to the NSW Restigrar.

Of course John Molloy could have been an immigrant etc but I guess I will begin with the Hercules and use a process of elimination if possible.

Looking at the Colonial Secretaries correspondence on the State Archives doesn' yield anything for John Molloy.

State Records NSW (SRNSW) : NRS 1156, [X32], 1830, Hercules, p.1

Hopefully there will be more on him in the above record!!  As there is no Bio on Claim a Convict.

Thanks everyone regards Dianna


Offline Neale1961

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Re: John Molloy (convict??)
« Reply #6 on: Friday 01 January 21 00:57 GMT (UK) »
On John MOLLOY from Hercules II
Bond Indenture
Age 18
Education - Read
Religion  - RC
Single
Native Place - Armagh County
Trade or Calling - Stable Boy / Jockey
Offence – Horse stealing
Trial – Antrim March 1830
Sentence – 14 years
Former conviction – None
Height – 5 feet 5 ½ inches
Complexion – ruddy Frecked; eyes brown; hair brown
Tatoo of woman on right arm; on left arm tattoo of Fox, gate and “Tally Ho”
How disposed of – John AB.. (ABBOTT)

And then from Gaol entrance books …
John Molloy per Hercules 1830
Native place – Kild???
Religion - catholic
Trade or calling – groom
Trial in Windsor (no other detail)
Executed 2nd June 1836
(His trial was with John Stocking per York 1830 - a saddler from London)

That is all rather gruesome, however if both of these John Molloys are the same man, I think he is NOT the one you are looking for.

Bit in paper attached:
Milligan - Jardine – Glencross – Dinwoodie - Brown: (Dumfriesshire & Kirkcudbrightshire)
Clark – Faulds – Cuthbertson – Bryson – Wilson: (Ayrshire & Renfrewshire)
Neale – Cater – Kinder - Harrison: (Warwickshire & Queensland)
Roberts - Spry: (Cornwall, Middlesex & Queensland)
Munster: (Schleswig-Holstein & Queensland) and Plate: (Braunschweig, Neubruck & Queensland)

Offline haney

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Re: John Molloy (convict??)
« Reply #7 on: Friday 01 January 21 01:12 GMT (UK) »
Now this is exactly the kind of information I need, thanks so much.  Now this John MOLLOY who arrived on the Hercules II in 1830 was executed in 1836 Right!  Well it looks like the people/person claiming that this Hercules II John is theirs have not done too much research!!  Fantastic!  Now I can eliminate this guy from the story and concentrate on the correct JOHN MOLLOY.

I will look into what you have sent on the executed JOHN thanks so much for that.  WONDERFUL. Many thanks.  Dianna

Offline majm

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Re: John Molloy (convict??)
« Reply #8 on: Friday 01 January 21 01:36 GMT (UK) »
Hi thanks for your replies.  Firstly should I make contact with "Claim a convict" to see if this is a descendant who has claimed him already?? 

John MOLLOY was married to the same lady twice once as a Non-Catholic marriage and later in the Catholic church in Mudgee.  They may have felt that their marriage to each other was no valid unless in the Catholic church.

I feel as though I have to start this research all over again as it has not been ascertained from what I can see that the John MOLLOY who died in Mudgee in 1875 aged 68 (in NSW for 45 years!) therefore arrival in approximately 1830--could be off though, is the same man on the Hercules.

That is why I'm trying to find what information I can on him.  Both his marriage records to Hannah/Johanna McKenna are lacking the necessary details and I may have to contact the Archives office (MUDGEE for the Catholic Church) to see if anymore can be found.  Hopefully the priest asked for more details than he submitted to the NSW Restigrar.

Of course John Molloy could have been an immigrant etc but I guess I will begin with the Hercules and use a process of elimination if possible.

Looking at the Colonial Secretaries correspondence on the State Archives doesn' yield anything for John Molloy.

State Records NSW (SRNSW) : NRS 1156, [X32], 1830, Hercules, p.1

Hopefully there will be more on him in the above record!!  As there is no Bio on Claim a Convict.

Thanks everyone regards Dianna

The 1864 marriage .... the clergy would have been in breach of NSW statute law ....

JM
The information in my posts is provided for academic and non-commercial research purposes. 
Random Acts of Kindness Given Freely are never Worthless for they are Priceless.
Qui scit et non docet.    Qui docet et non vivit.    Qui nescit et non interrogat.   
All Census Look Ups Are Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
I do not have a face book or a twitter account.