Author Topic: Help to ID medals, please  (Read 393 times)

Offline Fliss

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Help to ID medals, please
« on: Tuesday 05 January 21 18:47 GMT (UK) »
Hello!
These medals were awarded to a London man who served with the Grenadier Guards (pre WWI), then the Royal Fusiliers and finally the Chinese Labour Corps.
I'd appreciate help identifying these medals please. There will almost certainly be WWI medals but possibly Boer War too. I apologise that the photo isn't clearer.
With grateful thanks.
Fliss
BATE, CARTER, SIDDORN - Cheshire
PAWSEY - Suffolk & Middx
PICTON & HOWARD - Middx & US
PALMER & FREEMAN - Suffolk & Middx
GURNEY & COLLINS - Bucks & Middlx
MUNT - Herts & Middx
CHARLES - Devon & Middx
GLEED - Northants & Middx
WILSON - Bucks & Middx
SMITH - Lechlade & Lambeth & Surrey
FARRER - Lowestoft & Newington & Surrey
FAIRBRASS - Kent & Surrey
HOUSE & YOUNG - Compton Dando / Burnett, Somerset
YOUNG - Bingley / Bradford, Yks
RAMSDEN - Bradford, Brackley area
ENGLISH - Tynemouth & Wales

Offline SiGr

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Re: Help to ID medals, please
« Reply #1 on: Tuesday 05 January 21 19:25 GMT (UK) »
Hi, there,
If you go to
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_campaign_medals
you can get more details. To me it looks like (from left to right as you look at the medals):
1. Queen’s Sudan Medal (1899)
2. Queen’s South Africa Medal (1899) with three bars
3. 1914-15 Star
4. British War Medal
5. Victory Medal
6. Uncertain. Likely foreign as there is no British monarch’s head
Happy to be corrected by those better informed.
Good luck with your research.
Simon
(1) Janions of Cheshire, Lancashire, Hawaii, Vancouver and Seattle.
(2) Gregorys of Tarporley, Cheshire.
(3) Pughs of 'The New Pale' near Frodsham and Delamere in Cheshire.
(4) Nevills of Llanelly, Llangennech and Felinfoel.
(5) Yaldens of Ovington/Lovington in Hampshire.

Offline Jebber

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Re: Help to ID medals, please
« Reply #2 on: Tuesday 05 January 21 19:52 GMT (UK) »
If you like to give his name someone will probably be able to tell you more, the Medal Roll should tell you for which  the QSA bars relate.
CHOULES All ,  COKER Harwich Essex & Rochester Kent 
COLE Gt. Oakley, & Lt. Oakley, Essex.
DUNCAN Kent
EVERITT Colchester,  Dovercourt & Harwich Essex
GULLIVER/GULLOFER Fifehead Magdalen Dorset
HORSCROFT Kent.
KING Sturminster Newton, Dorset. MONK Odiham Ham.
SCOTT Wrabness, Essex
WILKINS Stour Provost, Dorset.
WICKHAM All in North Essex.
WICKHAM Medway Towns, Kent from 1880
WICKHAM, Ipswich, Suffolk.


Offline Rockford

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Re: Help to ID medals, please
« Reply #3 on: Tuesday 05 January 21 22:39 GMT (UK) »
Hello,

To my untrained eye, it looks like 1 & 2 are as identified above, followed by the three WW1 medals

For the last one, it could be a foreign/overseas medal, or an UK one as there are loads of medals that can be worn after campaign medals -  see the current Order of Wear rules here on page 326 [and continued on page 327] of the London Gazette.

https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/62529/supplement/326

The suspender (the bar from which the medal hangs) on the last medal looks very like the one on the British War Medal, so I would tend towards it being a British/UK one, as there doesn't appear to be a likely contender in either the French or the Belgian medals awarded for war service:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orders,_decorations,_and_medals_of_France
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orders,_decorations,_and_medals_of_Belgium
  edited - see next post

If you can post his name and his regiment, this might help narrow down the possibilities :)

Best wishes

Rockford
Burnside [Londonderry, Lothians and Pennsylvania]
Thorburn [Lanarkshire], Vair [Melrose]
Sweeney [Donegal/Lanarkshire]
Gilchrist [Lanarkshire, Peebles, Lothians], Smith [Dunbartonshire, Lanarkshire, Lothians]
Gregory [Bucks, Wales], Bennett [Somerset, Wales]
Letherby/Howlett/Phipps [Somerset]
Hunter [New Monkland, Fife], Gwynne [New Monkland, Stirling, Midlothian]
Logie/Dunlop/Thomson/Young [West Lothian]

Offline Rockford

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Re: Help to ID medals, please
« Reply #4 on: Tuesday 05 January 21 22:50 GMT (UK) »
Back again,

I think I have a winner.....

The Khedive's Sudan Medal:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khedive%27s_Sudan_Medal_(1897)

Although the two end stripes are an orangey colour, the tones won't show on old film - for example, the middle stripe on the British War Medal is also orange and looks very dark grey.

It apparently could include clasps, which is great as your photo shows one, which is perhaps likely to be Sudan.

It looks like he may be wearing it back to front :)

Hope this is of help!

Rockford.
Burnside [Londonderry, Lothians and Pennsylvania]
Thorburn [Lanarkshire], Vair [Melrose]
Sweeney [Donegal/Lanarkshire]
Gilchrist [Lanarkshire, Peebles, Lothians], Smith [Dunbartonshire, Lanarkshire, Lothians]
Gregory [Bucks, Wales], Bennett [Somerset, Wales]
Letherby/Howlett/Phipps [Somerset]
Hunter [New Monkland, Fife], Gwynne [New Monkland, Stirling, Midlothian]
Logie/Dunlop/Thomson/Young [West Lothian]

Offline SiGr

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(1) Janions of Cheshire, Lancashire, Hawaii, Vancouver and Seattle.
(2) Gregorys of Tarporley, Cheshire.
(3) Pughs of 'The New Pale' near Frodsham and Delamere in Cheshire.
(4) Nevills of Llanelly, Llangennech and Felinfoel.
(5) Yaldens of Ovington/Lovington in Hampshire.

Offline Fliss

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Re: Help to ID medals, please
« Reply #6 on: Wednesday 06 January 21 16:55 GMT (UK) »
Oh wow... thank you for all your interest and help; I'm so grateful.

I have gleaned the following information from service papers I've found on 'ancestry.co.uk and apologise if I've interpreted it incorrectly!

His name was William Preston (middle name Frederick but this did not appear on his service records with the Royal Fusiliers or the Chinese Labour Corps) born circa 1873.

According to his Royal Fusilier papers he was born in Birmingham and I know his father was Isaac Preston.

Please don't confuse him with another William Preston who was also serving in the Grenadier Guards at the same time. That one was William (possible middle name Charles) Preston born 1873 in Derby, father John Preston.

I have been unable to locate any details of 'my' William's service with the Grenadier Guards, although his marriage certificate (1894) and various papers associated to his WWI service indicate he served with the 1st and 3rd Battalions. He was discharged from the Grenadier Guards             
on 1 Oct 1904.

23 Aug 1914 - Attested with the Royal Fusiliers. Different documents state he was with             
12th Company, or 12/2 Company. Service No: 4025.
Other paperwork refers to William being a Corporal with Service No: 594.

10 Sept 1914 - Formally discharged from the Grenadier Guards ‘Irregularly enlisted’.
Formally transferred to the 7th Battalion, Royal Fusiliers. Rank: Acting Corporal. Also served with the 7th and 16th Battalions. (confusing considering the information above!)

1 Sept 1916 -Transferred/posted to the 22nd Training Reserve Battalion as now unfit for overseas service.

25 July 1919  - William re-enlisted in the Chinese Labour Corps in the rank of Acting Sergeant. Service No 714272.

 5 March 1920 - William was discharged from the Chinese Labour Corps.

Any help, no matter how small, will be much appreciated, regarding the medals and particularly regarding his pre-WWI service with the Grenadier Guards.                    Thank you!

BATE, CARTER, SIDDORN - Cheshire
PAWSEY - Suffolk & Middx
PICTON & HOWARD - Middx & US
PALMER & FREEMAN - Suffolk & Middx
GURNEY & COLLINS - Bucks & Middlx
MUNT - Herts & Middx
CHARLES - Devon & Middx
GLEED - Northants & Middx
WILSON - Bucks & Middx
SMITH - Lechlade & Lambeth & Surrey
FARRER - Lowestoft & Newington & Surrey
FAIRBRASS - Kent & Surrey
HOUSE & YOUNG - Compton Dando / Burnett, Somerset
YOUNG - Bingley / Bradford, Yks
RAMSDEN - Bradford, Brackley area
ENGLISH - Tynemouth & Wales

Offline Fliss

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Re: Help to ID medals, please
« Reply #7 on: Wednesday 06 January 21 17:12 GMT (UK) »
Realised I have this photo too of William Preston; might this help ID the medal?
BATE, CARTER, SIDDORN - Cheshire
PAWSEY - Suffolk & Middx
PICTON & HOWARD - Middx & US
PALMER & FREEMAN - Suffolk & Middx
GURNEY & COLLINS - Bucks & Middlx
MUNT - Herts & Middx
CHARLES - Devon & Middx
GLEED - Northants & Middx
WILSON - Bucks & Middx
SMITH - Lechlade & Lambeth & Surrey
FARRER - Lowestoft & Newington & Surrey
FAIRBRASS - Kent & Surrey
HOUSE & YOUNG - Compton Dando / Burnett, Somerset
YOUNG - Bingley / Bradford, Yks
RAMSDEN - Bradford, Brackley area
ENGLISH - Tynemouth & Wales

Offline Fliss

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Re: Help to ID medals, please
« Reply #8 on: Wednesday 06 January 21 17:13 GMT (UK) »
Sorry - probably too blurred!
BATE, CARTER, SIDDORN - Cheshire
PAWSEY - Suffolk & Middx
PICTON & HOWARD - Middx & US
PALMER & FREEMAN - Suffolk & Middx
GURNEY & COLLINS - Bucks & Middlx
MUNT - Herts & Middx
CHARLES - Devon & Middx
GLEED - Northants & Middx
WILSON - Bucks & Middx
SMITH - Lechlade & Lambeth & Surrey
FARRER - Lowestoft & Newington & Surrey
FAIRBRASS - Kent & Surrey
HOUSE & YOUNG - Compton Dando / Burnett, Somerset
YOUNG - Bingley / Bradford, Yks
RAMSDEN - Bradford, Brackley area
ENGLISH - Tynemouth & Wales