Kirk Family North Notts

[gaz2195]

Hi, this is a long shot more than likely, but I'm researching part of my family that I haven't been able to solve for a while.

I have traced my mother's side up the paternal leg and have an ancestor I'm pretty sure about, William Kirk born 20 Jan 1766 in Clayworth, Nottinghamshire. He married Sarah Ollivant 2 Oct 1788 also in Clayworth. On the parish records his parents are listed and Jonathan and Ann.

This is where I come to a halt. I cannot find a marriage that matches those two. I can however find a marriage between and Jonathan Kirk and Mary Stoker in 1755. There are numerous children born in Clayworth around that time and weirdly, none of them overlap, nor do any of the names repeat (other than where there has been an infant death). I'm wondering whether Ann and Mary are in fact the same person, but shown different on parish records. In succession;

Marriage of Jonathan to Mary Stoker 1755
Births, all Clayworth;
Elizabeth (Feb 1756) Mother Mary
John (May 1758) Mother Ann
Thomas (Feb 1760) Mother Ann
Jonathan (Dec 1760) Mother Ann
Mary (Nov 1762) Mother Ann (died within 5 days of birth)
Sarah (Oct 1763) Mother Mary
William (Jan 1766) Mother Ann
Ann (Apr 1768) Mother Mary
George (Oct 1770) Mother Ann
Robert (Sep 1772) Mother Mary
Mary (Mar 1775) Mother Ann

I cannot find anything to prove or disprove that these are indeed all siblings.

Clayworth is a very small village and right from the time of these births up until the late 1800's, the family didn't move far at all, only to the surrounding villages.

There seems to be a death record for a Jonathan that fits, that puts his estimated birth at 1723, which would mean he'd be 52 at the last birth.

If anyone has any info, it would be much appreciated

[larkspur]

Its not helping you at all. But on NFHS Robert baptised 27 Nov 1772 has his mother named as Elizabeth!
On the baptisms of Wm, George, Robt and Mary their father is listed as a labourer. Jonathan born 24 Dec 1760 and baptised 21 Jan 1761 has no mother named on his baptism.
 The birth dates as well as baptisms are listed for each child.

NFHS has only the one marriage you mention above surname being KIRKE. I can find no marriage with an Ann(e)

[gaz2195]

Thanks. When looking through ancestry and FindMyPast there were two records (sometimes 3) for each birth. From memory, there were parish transcriptions, england and wales births and nottinghamshire births.

On the ones you noticed that had no mother, or different mother, they differed on each record and some showed info where the others didn't.

I have a bit of old software on my laptop with births, deaths and marriages that I think might be a NFHS produced one. It just misses that vital marriage record that would prove or disprove the theory.

One other thing that bothers me is that if the Jonathan Kirk in question is the one from 1723 (based on one dieing in the parish with a stated age), as stated above he'd not only be 52 at the age of the last child, but also be a bit older than Mary Stoker by roughly 10 years.

[larkspur]

https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=369419.0

You may have already come across this..

The 1755 marriage says grooms parish was Wyston and brides Clayworth. Witnesses Samuel Scott and Thomas Branwood. Jonathan was a bachelor. Mary a spinster.
There are no Stoker baptisms in Clayworth on my cd.

Wiseton is a hamlet next to Clayworth.

[gaz2195]

Thanks, I've seen that record but can't tie in the correct Jonathan. There's a death in Clayworth for a Jonathan with an age that places him born 1723, but nothing to confirm that's the one that marries Mary Stoker. We also don't have a Jonathan born 1723 in any of the records from the surrounding villages.

There are Kirks born in Clayworth at the back end of the 1600's (that also share all the repeated family forenames), but then a gap to the 1750's. That eithet means that a record set is missing for Clayworth, or that they moved elsewhere and came back

[larkspur]

Have checked my cd for all the baptisms at Clayworth.
1750  +- 10 years---246 records
1730 +- 10 Years---196 records
1710  +- 10 years 268 records
1690  +- 10 years 280 records
1670  +- 10 years 0 records

There are 26 records of baptisms for KIRK with open dates.
There are 4 records for KIRKE

[gaz2195]

Kirk and Kirke seemed to change pretty regularly throughout my tree, depending on which parish they were in at the time.

I only have 7 birth records for Kirk(e) between 1671 and 1683 and a further birth in 1740, so looks like I'm missing a fair few.

After 1756 there are a lot more, so I was hoping I'd be able to fill the gap in the middle.

I wonder whether there are also marriage records in that period that I haven't seen either and that's whats causing my brick wall

EDIT.......just re-read and noticed you said you had 30 with 'open dates'. I think I have a similar number when I include ones after 1750 as well, barring the odd one of two. It does seem therefore, that they moved elsewhere. My gut feel is either North / South Wheatley or Sturton Le Steeple, though I still can't tie up the people from the late 1600's to the ones in the 1750's

[larkspur]

Marriage at Clayworth.. there are 4 male and 4 female KIRK  and 2 male and 2 female KIRKE.

Burials at Clayworth..there are 15 KIRK and 2 KIRKE.

Baptisms North Wheatley..10 KIRK between 1786-1897// 11 KIRKE between 1739-1840

No baptisms at South Wheatley and Sturton is not covered on my disc.

Marriage N Wheatley... 6 Nov 1774 George Black & Sarah KIRKE
5 Jan 1789 John Newton and Anne KIRK.  18 Jun 1868 Nathan Hunt & Harriet KIRK... 16 Aug 1747 Thomas KIRKE & Anne Spencer. 19 Jun 1815 Thomas KIRK & Sarah Porter. 25 May 1896 George KIRK & Harriet Laura Brown.
No marriages at South Wheatley, but Sturton is covered..13 Nov 1744 Jonas KIRK & Martha Parkinson. 3 Jan 1770 William KIRK & Ann Meekley. 6 Jul 1772 Robert KIRKE & Ann Lane.

Burials N Wheatley 4 KIRKE and 4 KIRK.
S. Wheatley 29 May 1893 Sarah Ann KIRK aged 52
no burials at Sturton.