CM Generations?

[Taylor94]

Hello
I've got my DNA on GEDMATCH but I'm interested in a match I have with someone.

They are my 2nd highest match in terms of total CM and Gen but their tree has no links to mine.

My highest match is with a confirmed 3rd cousin 1x removed. His Great Great Grandparents are my Great Great Great Grandparents. This is confirmed on paper and DNA now.
We share total CM of 48.6, Gen at 4.1, overlap of 51390 (I'm not sure what overlap means or represents?) largest segment is 24.6.

My 2nd highest match is of a Dutch gentleman who shares with me 41.8 total CM, Gen at 4.2, overlap of 282077 and largest segment at 10.2.
I contacted the person running this gedcom and they provided me (very kindly) with his ancestry tree. This shows his ancestors all in the Netherlands during the 1800s and 1700s on some lines.

What generation would me and this dutch gentleman share given our dna connection? As my top match shares my 3rd great grandparents (Born in Leicester during the 1820s) would we then in theory share my 4th or 5th great grandparents?
I have no ancestors outside of England and Ireland on paper. My tree is well researched on both sides of my family, to the best records can give me and DNA matches have confirmed.

The only thing I can think is that this gentleman shares an ancestor from my great grandfathers line as his paternal side is the only one I don't know on paper or otherwise. (He was born illegitimate in 1921 when his mother was 15 and nobody ''knew'' who his father was, not even his mother would say who it was...) This wouldn't be a stretch as my great grandfather comes from a very rural area in East Anglia where Dutch people were known to settle to drain the area.

Any ideas?

[JohnDoe2020]

Go to DNA Painter and enter the CMs. (Free) this will provide the probability of the match relationship. The options are influenced by generation, review the chart below the probability table which will show the possible relationships to you. Is the match your age? Younger or Older? You can then identify where you might match.

In general that is a pretty close match to your 3C1R, which may indicate you connect in about the same place.

[Ruskie]

Can I confirm that you found this Dutch match on Gedmatch?

Do you know which company he tested with? I wonder if it might be easier/clearer if you compare results via the same companies’ site.  Then you might more easily see which matches you both have in common and you may be able to work out where you connect. Not everyone who has taken a DNA test puts their details on Gedmatch, so you could be misssing out on a lot of matches if you rely on that alone.

Are you sure you and the Dutch gent match through your great + grandfather’s paternal line? Could you match through a maternal line?

DNA is passed down randomly and not necessarily logically. As an example, my daughter has closer cm matches to some people than I do despite being a generation removed.

[Taylor94]

Sorry, for some reason I didn't get email updates of the replies.

I shall ask what company the DNA was put through. It is not actually the gentleman who uploaded his DNA but a paternal cousin of his. They are compiling a paternal DNA project and writing a book.
The uploader appears to think that it is a connection through the maternal side of this gent but also mentions that he (The uploader) also has a *small* (May be a red herring) connection to me but his sister doesn't. Looking at the ancestry tree the uploader gave me, all of the gents maternal and Paternal side have been traced, and all reside in and around Oostzaan in 1800s and 1700s. No names ring any bells for me so I'm a bit stumped as DNA would suggest that the gent and I share an ancestor in the mid to late 1700s at least.

What is interesting as I now remember and that you mention my great grandfathers maternal line as being the possible connection.
My grandfather (Son of my illegitimate maternal great grandfather mentioned in this thread) told me that his father said that his grandfather (father of my great grandfathers mother) said that his grandfather said that his grandfather was a ''Frenchman'' and ''Spoke French''. This is one of those fabled family rumours passed down and the reason I got hooked on Genealogy but I have yet to find this individual through my great grandfathers, grandfathers line, although I cant get his paternal line back past 1800 with certainty but no other names look Dutch or ''Non-English'' The paternal name is Bonnet/Bonnett and there is another branch of this name in the same county (Unrelated to my line as far as records show) who also have recorded a family rumour of a ''french ancestor coming to England during the french civil war'' there may not be truth in this but its a bit of a coincidence that they both report a continental ancestor. I wonder if this person in my family rumour was not french but dutch instead given the dna connection to the Netherlands at the right gen degree.

I shall message the account to see which company he originally used.

[Taylor94]

Hello,

I've looked back upon this again.
The Dutch man who I link with was born in 1959 so he is in-between my parents and grandparents generation.
I did notice that of all the about 40 cm matches I have, on paper they all share a connection from my 3rd or 4th great grandparents. One shares my great great grandmother at 38 cm and 3 segments.

Is it correct to *assume* that most people at about 40cm will share a match at about the same generation for me at least? Such as 3rd or 4th great grandparents about 1800 to 1840ish?

The Dutch man tested with family tree DNA, I have my uploaded autosomal on there but I can't find him, but I did find matches at the 12-14cm level which share some of the names he has and in the same general area, Oostzaan is just north of Amsterdam and these matches were listing ancestors just west of Amsterdam. The name de Vries was popping up and the Dutch man has that name on both sides of his family.

I think my next port of call is to test my mother, as if she also matches with him that gives more likelihood to a connection through my great grandfathers unknown father.

[aghadowey]

The Dutch man tested with family tree DNA, I have my uploaded autosomal on there but I can't find him...

FTDNA just did a major scramble with their DNA matches and it was supposed to be sorted by the 23rd July (it isn't) so keep an eye out and you Dutch match may eventually appear. Some of my confirmed relatives have vanished from my earlier results but I'm hoping I will see them again.

Not sure if I've followed this correctly but generations just don't go by ages. My grandfather was raised with his nephews the same age (he was youngest in a family of ten and the nephews were sons of eldest brother). OH and I are roughly the same age and his parents were around the same age as my grandparents, his grandparents the ages of my great-grandparents, etc.

[Ruskie]

I was going to say the same as you about generations aghadowey. I’m 7 years older than my OH but his father and my grandfather were born around the same year.

I’m also not sure your 40cm equalling 3 or 4x great grandparent generation can be relied upon.

Yes, most definitely test your mother. Her results should be useful but keep in mind that weird things can happen. A simple example ... My father has some matches that I do not have, but my daughter does, or she has a higher cm match with someone than I do (as mentioned previously). 

[Petros]

On Ancestry I have a 3C1R (29 cM) and a 4C1R (28 cM) both descended from my paternal line yet neither is a shared match to my cousin. Another 4C1R from the same line is only a 10cM match

[aghadowey]

On Ancestry I have a 3C1R (29 cM) and a 4C1R (28 cM) both descended from my paternal line yet neither is a shared match to my cousin. Another 4C1R from the same line is only a 10cM match

I manage 3 kits and in all three there are instances where there's a match with 1 sibling/cousin but not another. For one family kit #1 matches a person & 2 of their first cousins but not a sibling whilst kit #2 matches the same person along with the sibling & one of the first cousins but not the other cousin.