Author Topic: George James Crocker  (Read 1045 times)

Offline Neale1961

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Re: George James Crocker
« Reply #63 on: Tuesday 06 April 21 22:43 BST (UK) »
Regarding George HOGG.
He was buried 10 Nov 1891 Morpeth, age 87.
His place of birth is different on the various census records, but his age remains constant and would suggest birth around 1804-1805.

I believe George’s baptism may have been in Alnwick in Nov 1804 (born 16 Nov 1804) to parents Isabella and James Hogg (a labourer). I suspect the mother’s name on the baptism record has been written as “Ann” in error – I believe it should be Isabella. The name “Isabella” of course was used for George’s third daughter.

James Hogg and Isabella marriage was in Alnwick in 1795.
https://www.freereg.org.uk/search_records/5de2b06ff493fd85a0aff3e7/isabella-richardson-james-hogg-marriage-northumberland-alnwick-1795-08-11?locale=en

The 4 children of James and Isabella HOGG were baptised in Alnwick: James in 1798, Ann in 1801, William in 1802, and George in 1804

Death for George’s mother - Isabella Hogg in 1810
https://www.freereg.org.uk/search_records/5e69168cf493fd38df376887/isabella-hogg-burial-northumberland-earsdon-1810-06-10?locale=en
 
Likely death for George’s father – James Hogg in 1826
https://www.freereg.org.uk/search_records/581871a2e93790ec752d7f56/james-hogg-burial-northumberland-earsdon-1826-08-05?locale=en


Isabella was a widow (Richardson) on her marriage to James Hogg. It looks like she had other children. There are 2 children born in Alnwick to Robert and Isabella Richardson: Isabella Margarita in 1789, Collingwood Augustus Hamilton in 1791.
Robert Richardson was an attorney at law – he died 12 Sept 1792 in Alnwick.

Robert and Isabella married 1787 in Alnwick (her maiden name was Purvis, her father was James), (Robert was a widower):
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HY-6SJS-N81?i=572&cc=1675690
OR
https://www.freereg.org.uk/search_records/5de2b035f493fd85a0afeacf/isabella-purvis-robert-richardson-marriage-northumberland-alnwick-1787-10-09?locale=en

Chucky - All these records in Northumberland can be found on   https://www.freereg.org.uk/freereg_contents/new?locale=en
I hope I have this info all correct – someone will come and correct if not.
Milligan - Jardine – Glencross – Dinwoodie - Brown: (Dumfriesshire & Kirkcudbrightshire)
Clark – Faulds – Cuthbertson – Bryson – Wilson: (Ayrshire & Renfrewshire)
Neale – Cater – Kinder - Harrison: (Warwickshire & Queensland)
Roberts - Spry: (Cornwall, Middlesex & Queensland)
Munster: (Schleswig-Holstein & Queensland) and Plate: (Braunschweig, Neubruck & Queensland)

Offline Chucky_60

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Re: George James Crocker
« Reply #64 on: Wednesday 07 April 21 12:59 BST (UK) »
Thank you so much Neale1961
Vaughan & Everson, Stilling & Smith, Crocker & Hogg, Northey & England, deCheppe & Barley, Broad & Wise

Offline Neale1961

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Re: George James Crocker
« Reply #65 on: Wednesday 07 April 21 23:20 BST (UK) »
A bit more about Isabella HOGG – She was baptised 7 Feb 1847, Morpeth
https://www.freereg.org.uk/search_records/5818cac2e93790ec8b2cbd27/isabella-hogg-baptism-northumberland-morpeth-1847-02-07?locale=en

& 10 days later, her mother Anne (Dobson) Hogg was buried. (Anne’s age on the burial record is not correct, and does not match the death registration)
https://www.freereg.org.uk/search_records/581873dce93790ec75301c30/anne-hogg-burial-northumberland-morpeth-1847-02-17?locale=en

I think it is most likely that Ann’s parents were Thomas and Elizabeth DOBSON who lived next door to the family in 1851.
I find it interesting and unusual at this time in history that George never re-married. Although he would not have been able to care for a new-born baby Isabella, he still managed to raise 2 other children – he must have had help from his in-laws. Other relations stepped in to help to raise baby Isabella.

Marriage for Thomas DOBSON and Elizabeth CHILTON  in Ulgham 6 Nov 1811.
https://www.freereg.org.uk/search_records/581829f8e93790eb7f499ab1/elisabeth-chilton-thomas-dobson-marriage-northumberland-ulgham-1811-11-06?locale=en

Elizabeth (Chilton) DOBSON, age 71 – burial 22 Aug 1854, Morpeth
According to 1851 census, Elizabeth born about 1784 in Fenham (Newcastle upon Tyne)
Likely baptism for Elizabeth CHILTON 21 Sept 1783, Newcastle upon Tyne to parents Thomas CHILTON (occup - pitman) and Ann
https://www.freereg.org.uk/search_records/5818ce52e93790ec8b33655d/elizabeth-chilton-baptism-northumberland-newcastle-upon-tyne-1783-09-21?locale=en

Thomas DOBSON, age 70 -  burial 3 Sep 1854, Morpeth
According to 1851 census, Thomas born about 1785 in Widdrington
Likely baptism for Thomas DOBSON 24 Sept 1786 Widdrington to parents Jonathon DOBSON and Mary
https://www.freereg.org.uk/search_records/5f934824f493fdb860abe1c9/thomas-dobson-baptism-northumberland-widdrington-1786-09-24?locale=en
Milligan - Jardine – Glencross – Dinwoodie - Brown: (Dumfriesshire & Kirkcudbrightshire)
Clark – Faulds – Cuthbertson – Bryson – Wilson: (Ayrshire & Renfrewshire)
Neale – Cater – Kinder - Harrison: (Warwickshire & Queensland)
Roberts - Spry: (Cornwall, Middlesex & Queensland)
Munster: (Schleswig-Holstein & Queensland) and Plate: (Braunschweig, Neubruck & Queensland)


Offline sparrett

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Re: George James Crocker
« Reply #66 on: Thursday 08 April 21 00:19 BST (UK) »
I must say what great work from especially Neale and Debra in moving this search forward for Chucky. ;D

A question from me.
Neale in Reply # 63 lists the children of George James and Isabella HOGG and includes Ann b. 1801.

The 4 children of James and Isabella HOGG were baptised in Alnwick: James in 1798, Ann in 1801, William in 1802, and George in 1804

I see on census 1841 Hannah TELFORD  with husband and family, it suggests Hannah TELFORD (nee HOGG) was born in Carham. A birth year given of 1801.

In reply #60 from Debra, gives us the 1851 census including George HOGG , born Carham.

George HOGG, aged 43, Gardener born Carham, Northumberland.
Elizabeth HOGG, dau, aged 11, born Morpeth
Mary HOGG, dau, aged 8 born Morpeth


Debra  :)

Given the general  flexibility in ages given on the 1841 census (often a few years out), do we think Ann and Hannah are the same person ? Hannah, Anna , Ann all being derivatives.
So Ann/Hannah is George HOGG’s sister?
 
Sue

Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline Neale1961

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Re: George James Crocker
« Reply #67 on: Thursday 08 April 21 02:50 BST (UK) »
I agree Sue,
Debra / Dundee really “cracked the nut” with her reply #60 and allowed things to progress.
Given the general  flexibility in ages given on the 1841 census (often a few years out), do we think Ann and Hannah are the same person ? Hannah, Anna , Ann all being derivatives.
So Ann/Hannah is George HOGG’s sister?

I think your suggestion about Hannah being Ann, George’s sister is a very good thought, especially since the Telford’s first daughter was named Isabella (named after her grandmother?)

I have tried to move forward on the connection between Hannah (Hogg) Telford and George Hogg, but without success. Every time I think of a new avenue to pursue, it leads me to a dead end. I cannot even find a marriage record for Hannah (or Ann) Hogg to Thomas Telford. Perhaps they did not marry. I cannot find any baptisms for the children listed in the census either. I even went on a trip to Scotland  :) in case things happened over the border - nothing.
I am running out of ideas.

Information from the census is conflicting regarding birth date and place for Hannah:
1841 census in Carham, Northumberland
•   Thomas Telford 35 , ag lab, born in county
•   Hannah Telford 35 born in county (maiden name Hogg)
•   Isabella 10 born in county
•   Elizabeth 5 born in county
•   John 5 born in county
•   George 1 born in county

1851 census in Carham, Northumberland
•   Thomas Telford 45, born Northumberland
•   Hannah Telford 50, born Cornhill?, Durham  (maiden name Hogg - Died 1852, registered death age 54)
I believe the transcipt is incorrect and it possibly reads Carham
•   Isabell , 22 daughter, born Carham 1829
•   Elizabeth, 18 daughter, born ? 1833   (cannot read place name)
•   John, 16 son, born ? 1835 (cannot read place name)
•   George, 11 son, born Carham 1840
•   Isabell Hogg, 4 niece, born Morpeth 1847

I found a Hannah Hogg born 1802 in Durham to William Hogg and wife Hannah. Maybe this William is a brother to James Hogg (George’s father)??   ???
Milligan - Jardine – Glencross – Dinwoodie - Brown: (Dumfriesshire & Kirkcudbrightshire)
Clark – Faulds – Cuthbertson – Bryson – Wilson: (Ayrshire & Renfrewshire)
Neale – Cater – Kinder - Harrison: (Warwickshire & Queensland)
Roberts - Spry: (Cornwall, Middlesex & Queensland)
Munster: (Schleswig-Holstein & Queensland) and Plate: (Braunschweig, Neubruck & Queensland)

Offline Neale1961

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Re: George James Crocker
« Reply #68 on: Thursday 08 April 21 06:17 BST (UK) »
Curious things – in looking for Baptisms for Telford children I have come across these 2 for the youngest George.

There is this birth registration:
 TELFORD, GEORGE    Mother: FLETCHER 
GRO Reference: 1839  D Quarter in THE MORPETH UNION  Volume 25  Page 270

There is this baptism:
George HOGG bapt. Longbenton 16 Feb 1840 to mother Hannah Hogg (a Spinster)

I wonder if the children listed with surname Telford on the census were in fact illegitimate children of either Thomas or Hannah, or children from previous marriages, or fostered kids picked up here and there.  Puzzling. I am beginning to suspect Thomas and Hannah were not married.
Milligan - Jardine – Glencross – Dinwoodie - Brown: (Dumfriesshire & Kirkcudbrightshire)
Clark – Faulds – Cuthbertson – Bryson – Wilson: (Ayrshire & Renfrewshire)
Neale – Cater – Kinder - Harrison: (Warwickshire & Queensland)
Roberts - Spry: (Cornwall, Middlesex & Queensland)
Munster: (Schleswig-Holstein & Queensland) and Plate: (Braunschweig, Neubruck & Queensland)

Offline Chucky_60

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Re: George James Crocker
« Reply #69 on: Thursday 08 April 21 07:33 BST (UK) »
Please see the attached, thank you Chucky.

Vaughan & Everson, Stilling & Smith, Crocker & Hogg, Northey & England, deCheppe & Barley, Broad & Wise

Offline sparrett

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Re: George James Crocker
« Reply #70 on: Thursday 08 April 21 09:47 BST (UK) »


 

1851 census in Carham, Northumberland
•   Thomas Telford 45, born Northumberland
•   Hannah Telford 50, born Cornhill?, Durham  (maiden name Hogg - Died 1852, registered death age 54)
I believe the transcipt is incorrect and it possibly reads Carham
•   Isabell , 22 daughter, born Carham 1829
•   Elizabeth, 18 daughter, born ? 1833   (cannot read place name)
•   John, 16 son, born ? 1835 (cannot read place name)
•   George, 11 son, born Carham 1840
•   Isabell Hogg, 4 niece, born Morpeth 1847

I found a Hannah Hogg born 1802 in Durham to William Hogg and wife Hannah. Maybe this William is a brother to James Hogg (George’s father)??   ???


I think it might be COWSHILL Edit CORNHILL as originally stated for Hannah's birthplace.  ( IMO  ;D)
It is not far from BRANXTON which I think might be the hard- to- read birthplace of her daughter Elizabeth and son John on the same census.

In county would apply as it seems Cowshill EDITCornhill was brought into the county of Northumberland from Durham earlier in the century.

Chucky, fun picture!! ;D

Sue

edit with apologies
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline Neale1961

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Re: George James Crocker
« Reply #71 on: Thursday 08 April 21 22:54 BST (UK) »
Thanks for those place names Sue. Looking again, I think your interpretation of the "scrawl" is correct.
Maybe that Hannah Hogg born 1802 in Durham to William Hogg is the one to look at further.

Thanks for the "awesome" vote Chucky - not feeling very awesome going around in circles at the moment. :) Thank goodness Sue keeps me on track!
Milligan - Jardine – Glencross – Dinwoodie - Brown: (Dumfriesshire & Kirkcudbrightshire)
Clark – Faulds – Cuthbertson – Bryson – Wilson: (Ayrshire & Renfrewshire)
Neale – Cater – Kinder - Harrison: (Warwickshire & Queensland)
Roberts - Spry: (Cornwall, Middlesex & Queensland)
Munster: (Schleswig-Holstein & Queensland) and Plate: (Braunschweig, Neubruck & Queensland)