Author Topic: Joseph Henry Edgar, fatally shot & died on 9 July 1902, Armidale, N.S.W.  (Read 1967 times)

Offline Smilingwillowb

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Re: Joseph Henry Edgar, fatally shot & died on 9 July 1902, Armidale, N.S.W.
« Reply #9 on: Monday 12 April 21 08:28 BST (UK) »
Hi,
What information, apart from what you have, were you especially looking for?

Sue

ADDING  ;)
Another passionate verse by Matley.  Heartfelt anyway!
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/173606517

I think I'm pretty much there now, thanks, I have suggested links to work on. The main thing still to find out is the grave location, and its condition, also if there's a headstone or if he's in an unmarked public grave.

Offline judb

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Re: Joseph Henry Edgar, fatally shot & died on 9 July 1902, Armidale, N.S.W.
« Reply #10 on: Monday 12 April 21 09:06 BST (UK) »
This site gives the following information about his burial but there's not a lot of information re the actual gravesite.  The photo attached is the same as the one you have put up and was only attached to the site this month.

https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/225484136/joseph-henry-edgar/photo
Photo added by BereniceUK

Joseph Henry Edgar
BIRTH   unknown
DEATH   9 Jul 1902
Armidale, Armidale Regional Council, New South Wales, Australia
BURIAL   
Armidale General Cemetery
Armidale, Armidale Regional Council, New South Wales, Australia
MEMORIAL ID   225484136 · View Source


There is also this website which has photos and comments on graves at many cemeteries.  The site only shows graves with memorials and does not show unmarked graves.  Obviously not being listed on the site may just mean that the grave has been missed but I find it reasonably reliable.  Joseph is NOT shown on this site which implies that there is no memorial for him.
https://www.austcemindex.com/?cemetery=armidale

Judith



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Offline rosball

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Re: Joseph Henry Edgar, fatally shot & died on 9 July 1902, Armidale, N.S.W.
« Reply #11 on: Monday 12 April 21 23:37 BST (UK) »
There is also this site https://www.australiancemeteries.com.au/htm nsw/tamworth/tamworthgen.htm 
adding : The link to the Armidale C of E cemetery offers transcripts and takes you to the Armidale family history group.http://www.familyhistoryarmidale.org/index.htm 


I will check tomorrow if there is a probate file for him at the NSW archives. https://www.records.nsw.gov.au/  He doesn't appear on their online data but there is a gap in their indexes (c1891-c1927) which is on microfiche.   However I haven't found a probate notice on trove.

Such a sad story ...

Ros

edited to fix my confusion between Tamworth and Armidale cemetery - sorry was busy with an off-forum query about Tamworth.  How clever of you MAJM to have noticed  :)
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Offline NSWP

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Re: Joseph Henry Edgar, fatally shot & died on 9 July 1902, Armidale, N.S.W.
« Reply #12 on: Tuesday 13 April 21 00:24 BST (UK) »
Poor finding by the Coroner in my learned view.  A Manslaughter charge would have been more appropriate against the two men who admitted having live ammo and firing low into the said rail carriage.  RIP Joseph.
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Offline majm

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Re: Joseph Henry Edgar, fatally shot & died on 9 July 1902, Armidale, N.S.W.
« Reply #13 on: Tuesday 13 April 21 00:25 BST (UK) »
Hi there,

I share some further information.

1902, so this is before the motor car, it’s the era of the horse drawn carriage.  So there’s 70 miles (around 110 kms) between Tamworth and Armidale.    Tamworth is around 400 metres above sea level.  Armidale is around 980 metres above sea level.   Tamworth to Armidale is UPHILL all the way, and conversely, Armidale to Tamworth is DOWNHILL all the way.   Experienced people needed to be in charge of horses.   I would not expect anyone whose funeral service was at St Pauls, Armidale to be buried in Tamworth in 1902.   ADD, so nor would I expect anyone whose funeral was at St Peters Cathedral, Armidale to be buried in Tamworth in 1902.

Joseph Henry EDGAR’s younger brother was William.  William enlisted in the AIF, and he was KIA, 1917 and his 94 page B2455 Service file is readily available, no subscription required via the online website from the National Archives of Australia.   His Service number was 3475.  His nok was his mother.  https://www.naa.gov.au/

Here is the live link to the current local government authority covering Armidale. https://www.armidaleregional.nsw.gov.au/  It does NOT cover Tamworth.   Tamworth’s LGA is Tamworth Regional Council.  Here is that LGA’s website. https://www.tamworth.nsw.gov.au/

The Armidale LGA has responsibility for the cemeteries in its LGA.   Here is the live link for that…
 https://www.armidaleregional.nsw.gov.au/community/community-support/cemeteries-memorials   and here is the live link for Armidale cemetery. https://www.armidaleregional.nsw.gov.au/community/community-support/cemeteries-and-memorials/armidale-cemetery  The blurb at that link notes that the cemetery currently in use was dedicated in 1863, so many decades prior to Joseph EDGAR’s death.  That cemetery link has a live link to the Armidale Cemetery Map.  The map clearly shows the sections for each denomination including the Presbyterian.   To me, St Paul’s Armidale would be the Presbyterian and St Peter's, Armidale would be Anglican.   
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/192855544 Armidale Express, 5 May 1882. 
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/183165445 Armidale Chronicale 27  Feb 1895

The Register of Coroners’ Inquests includes the following:
Inquest from July 10 – 24 at Armidale, before J McLean, J.P., on Joseph Henry EDGAR, aged 23, born Rockvale, County of Clevedon, died Armidale Hospital, from Injuries received through a bullet wound at the Military Tattoo, Armidale.  Cash  or  Property possessed by Deceased : Nil.  A Post Mortem was held.

Add
I have just looked at the 1897 NSW map available online via  hlrv.nswlrs.com.au for ROCKVALE, and I can clearly see CP.73.12521 (194 acres) and CP, 71.3444 (126 acres) were originally conditional purchases for a Joseph Hamilton.    https://hlrv.nswlrs.com.au/ Perhaps this is where Joseph EDGAR was born, afterall, his mum was nee HAMILTON.

NSW BDM online index
Birth: EDGAR, Joseph H, parents as Samuel and Letitia, registered in the Armidale district.
Death: EDGAR, Joseph H, parents as Samuel and Letitia, registered in the Armidale district.

NSW BDMs are very detailed, include family history information. Death certs also include medical and burial information.   NSW BDM has licenced Official Transcribers. 

See these live links:
 https://www.nsw.gov.au/topics/family-history-search/family-history-research-guide
and
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,300394.0.html
and
http://www.jaunay.com/bdm.html

JM  Edit to provide live links to various online resources.

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Offline Kaybron

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Re: Joseph Henry Edgar, fatally shot & died on 9 July 1902, Armidale, N.S.W.
« Reply #14 on: Tuesday 13 April 21 02:13 BST (UK) »
Very extensive information majm.  A credit to you.

Offline sparrett

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Re: Joseph Henry Edgar, fatally shot & died on 9 July 1902, Armidale, N.S.W.
« Reply #15 on: Tuesday 13 April 21 03:13 BST (UK) »

Joseph Henry EDGAR’s younger brother was William.  William enlisted in the AIF, and he was KIA, 1917 and his 94 page B2455 Service file is readily available, no subscription required via the online website from the National Archives of Australia.   His Service number was 3475.  His nok was his mother.  https://www.naa.gov.au/



Some family history and helpful clues on the AIF file of William EDGAR

The family HAMILTON arrived in Victoria per Aloe in 1857. Joseph, Letitia and several children.
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/64986034
and apparently settled in the Armidale area.

They had another child after arrival in 1858, Letitiia HAMILTON.(#4261) Armidale.

I think Letitia had an ex-nuptial child.

SMITH Isabella J
6684/1875
Mother LETITIA
At ARMIDALE

After this birth, Letitia went on to marry Samuel EDGAR and had  children including William EDGAR in 1889. (#31197). William EDGAR,  the serviceman, therefore was a half-sibling to Isabella.

Isabella married Richard A BARTLETT, becoming the Mrs BARTLETT who wrote a letter in the digitized service file of William EDGAR.  She calls him her brother.
She is the beneficiary of his will as also mentioned in the file.

When Samuel EDGAR, Letitia’s husband, died in 1907, Letitia  remarried to Samuel Sebastian KEENER. 

KEENER Samuel S
EDGAR Letitia
At INVERELL
8016/1908
 
For some reason, William her son lists his mother as NOK in her former name of EDGAR, Mrs EDGAR,  and the AIF’s  letters advising her of William’s death  do not find her. However Isabella’s inquiry as seen in the file, identified him.

Mother  died
KEENER Letitia
13537/1937
Parents JOSEPH & LETITIA
At PETERSHAM

Sue
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Offline majm

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Re: Joseph Henry Edgar, fatally shot & died on 9 July 1902, Armidale, N.S.W.
« Reply #16 on: Tuesday 13 April 21 03:51 BST (UK) »
There is also this site https://www.australiancemeteries.com.au/nsw/tamworth/tamworthgen.htm 
adding : The link to the Armidale C of E cemetery offers transcripts and takes you to the Armidale family history group.http://www.familyhistoryarmidale.org/index.htm 


I will check tomorrow if there is a probate file for him at the NSW archives. https://www.records.nsw.gov.au/  He doesn't appear on their online data but there is a gap in their indexes (c1891-c1927) which is on microfiche.   However I haven't found a probate notice on trove.

Such a sad story ...

Ros

edited to fix my confusion between Tamworth and Armidale cemetery - sorry was busy with an off-forum query about Tamworth.  How clever of you MAJM to have noticed  :)


Rockvale is north of Armidale.   I have many relatives in and around Uralla, so I have known that Tamworth is south of Armidale all my life.   Like most RChatters, my email address receives notifications to threads that I have replied to.   Like most RChatters, I read those replies.  I see nothing clever about that at all, to me it is common sense, when responding to family history enquiries to consider the historical setting - the era, the social background, the local history aspects.    So for example,  Tamworth and Armidale, in the mid to late 1800s were not in the same electorate ... Tamworth ... on the Peel River, so 'Liverpool Plains'  ... Armidale up in the highlands of 'New England'.... quite distant from each other, different focuses, different conditions, different primary industries... 

JM
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Offline Smilingwillowb

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Re: Joseph Henry Edgar, fatally shot & died on 9 July 1902, Armidale, N.S.W.
« Reply #17 on: Tuesday 13 April 21 09:15 BST (UK) »
I'm the person who created the Find A Grave page for Joseph, and will add a biography for him when I've been through all the information you wonderful people have dug up. You're all amazing!

I totally agree with NSWP; there should have been a police investigation into the death. During the inquest, the jury wanted to visit the scene of the tragedy, but the Coroner kept refusing to allow it, things got very heated, and it was only when a Senior-Sergeant (police?) spoke up that it went ahead. At the conclusion of the inquest the Coroner said that he would be resigning.

Letitia Keener is buried at North Ryde, Ryde City, N.S.W. https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/191813784/letitia-keener

My thanks to you all, and should I get any information on his grave, including a photo, I'll add it here.