Ancestors of a nation

[HopefulToff]

Some of you may have heard of 8th-century Holy Roman Emperor Charlemagne being called ‘the Father of Europe’, and from a genealogy viewpoint, it’s certainly true. Scholarship by Dr. Mark Humphrys has proven that every European can be mathematically traced back to Charlemagne, because of exponential growth and pedigree collapse. But that got me thinking - what if you applied those genealogical principles to individual countries? Every Englishman/woman, Scotsman/woman and so on with mainly native ancestry, whether they’re prince or pauper, must have a common ancestor of nobility surely. So following on from kings who had plenty of grandchildren who bred, and the fact that everyone has 2 parents, 4 grandparents, 8, 16, 32 and so on, combined with a 20/25-year pattern, here’s who I think might be some of the national common ancestors of every native:

The English - Edward III of England
The Scottish - James V of Scotland
The Spanish - Ferdinand II of Aragon
The Danish - Christian I of Denmark

I suppose the question everyone must ask themselves if you’re interested in finding such a link, really isn’t “do I have royal ancestry?”, it’s “can I find my royal ancestry?”, and knowing just where to look.

[iluleah]

Most family historians are interested in researching and proving their real ancestry and having whoever their ancestors were in their tree.... mathematics doesn't come into that.

I suppose the question everyone must ask themselves if you’re interested in finding such a link, really isn’t “do I have royal ancestry?”, it’s “can I find my royal ancestry?”, and knowing just where to look.

No it is not a question I ask myself, what I ask myself is have I researched and found every possible real record in each ancestors lifetime so I can prove I have my own ancestors in my tree and not someone who just 'fits', the reality is researching back and PROVING them is very difficult especially pre 1800 simply as the records do not have the details required to prove it in many of them.

[Top-of-the-hill]

  This is a question that comes up occasionally; I believe Edward III is the king usually credited with being in most of our (English) ancestry, so you are right about that. I don't think many of us have considered the Spanish royal ancestors!

[DonM]

https://humphrysfamilytree.com

He's just stirring the gene pool with a dash of wonder and a cup of speculation.

Don

[coombs]

A certain man from EastEnders is a descendant of Edward III, that is providing there was not an informal adoption or a straying wife on the line between him and Edward.

As the generations multiply, the chances of an NPE (not parent expected) gets higher but you will probably never ever know of such events once you get back about 6 generations wit autosomal DNA unless it is Y DNA, your dads, dads, dads, dads, dads, dads, brothers sons, sons, sons, sons son. I think a break in such a line was found with Y-DNA in descendants of Richard III.

[GR2]

https://humphrysfamilytree.com

He's just stirring the gene pool with a dash of wonder and a cup of speculation.

Don

I have just had a look at one part of this - Alexander Dundas of Fingask (k. Pinkie 1547) and his wife Elizabeth Bruce. It gives Alexander's mother as Isabel Oliphant, whereas it was actually Helen Arnot (a document transferring the ownership of land by Alexander's son, Archibald, proves this). All the published genealogies I have seen for the Dundas of Fingask family have serious errors. The above Alexander's father was killed at Flodden in 1513. According to the published material he was extremely old. That is because they treat him and his grandfather of the same name as the same person and do not realise that James Dundas, who is mentioned in several contemporary records comes between them.

The problem arises when you rely on published pedigrees and genealogies. These may be starting points, but you then have to look at the original documents to see if they are correct.

[Viktoria]

Funny isn’t it, Kings etc,not for me .No interest.
I like to find the reverse ,that my  ancestors were poor, ordinary folk who brought up families as far as records go ,to be very decent hardworking people.
I wish some of mine were from the worst slum in Europe, an area of Victorian  Manchester,but no, the perverse devils came from nearby but not actually in that dreadful place.
More of an achievement to bring up decent families when people were poverty  stricken.
Common as muck I am ,and very proud of that but I hope those of you who do have Royal ancestors  enjoy the connection ,it is a bit special I do admit.
Viktoria ,p.

[Skoosh]

And Edward III's father was?

It's a wise bairn that kens his ain faither!

Skoosh.

[majm]

Who were their mothers ....  it's an even wiser babe that cares for their mum when she is in her final years.


JM