Pasmore / Passmore family help 1820s-1860s

[jonwicken]

Dear all,

I have two namesake couple who I need a bit of help with. I hope you might be able to give me some new eyes to the below queries. I have numbered them in individual posts to keep this post more digestable!

My grandad's grandmother Elizabeth Johanna Pasmore|Robey (1837-1897) was born to Cornish parents in London and I visited her grave in Australia when I was there over a decade go.

My queries relate to her parents and grandparents. The name can be spelt as Pasmore and Passmore. Her grandparents and parents are:

John Pasmore senior (born Parish of St Gluvias, Cornwall, 1781, died Poplar, Middlesex, 1864) married 1804 Camborne, Cornwall, Elizabeth Moneypenny (born Falmouth, Cornwall, 1775, died Poplar, Middlesex, 1847)

Their son John Pasmore junior (born Penryn, Cornwall, 1809, died Whitechapel, Middlesex, 1879) married 1832 Limehouse, Middlesex, Elizabeth Osborne Bastian (born Falmouth, Cornwall, 1814, died Bethnal Green, Middlesex, 1877).

These are my queries and if anyone is please able to help me with any of them, that would be amazing:

[jonwicken]

1. John Pasmore junior and Elizabeth Osborne Bastian had a daughter Elizabeth Catherine Pasmore baptised at St Dunstan Stepney in 1834. This shows they lived at Mile End. She must have died before December 1837 as they had my 2 x great grandmother Elizabeth Johanna Pasmore. Can anyone please find Elizabeth Catherine Pasmore's burial between 1834 and 1837?,

[jonwicken]

2. I can't find the baptism of my 2 x great grandmother Elizabeth Johanna Pasmore after December 1837. Her siblings John William (b.1832, d. 1833), Elizabeth Catherine (b.1834), Mary (b.1835) and Eliza Ann (b. 1839, d. 1842) were all baptised, so was she not or have I missed it?

[jonwicken]

3. John Pasmore junior and Elizabeth Osborne Bastian and their family cannot be found in the 1841 census which is almost certainly due to the fact the 1841 census returns for White Cross Street in St Luke's Middlesex are lost. However, I cannot find the family of John Pasmore junior in the 1851 census. They would have been a family of at least 4 at this time: John born c1809, Elizabeth born c1814 and surviving children Mary born c1835 and Elizabeth Johanna born c1837.

I have looked on ancestry and findmypast, but wonder if there is a transcription error. I would love to find them in the 1851 census to see the children.

[jonwicken]

4. John Pasmore junior and Elizabeth are however to be found in the 1861 census at 1 Waterloo Place, Whitecross Street, St Luke, Middlesex here: https://www.ancestry.co.uk/imageviewer/collections/8767/images/MDXRG9_203_205-0559?pId=8765367

They are in the same house as the Chapa family. Unexplained however is the listing of another Elizabeth Pasmore as a 10 year old daughter (it could be 16 but I think it is 10). This is not Elizabeth Johanna Pasmore born in 1837 as she married in 1856 and would have been 23 in 1861. Who is this other Elizabeth Pasmore born c1851?

Her occupation is tailoress in the census, although I think this might have been written in the wrong place and was her mother's profession. Something is not correct as the parents seem unlikely to have two living daughters called Elizabeth.

There is an 1866 settlement record here about the family when John Pasmore senior was in hospital. This can be read here: https://www.ancestry.co.uk/imageviewer/collections/2651/images/31363_a107618-00016?pId=125413

This 1866 document states that Elizabeth was aged 50 and she had two children in Elizabeth aged 12 (so born c1854) and John aged 8 (born c1858). Who are these children? There are no births or baptisms for them, so was young Elizabeth perhaps an illegitimate daughter of daughter Mary? Is John really Elizabeth Johanna's son John Robert Robey born in 1857?

I have no idea and would love a fresh input on this mystery!   

[jonwicken]

5. I have two questions relating to the 1866 settlement record mentioned above  (https://www.ancestry.co.uk/imageviewer/collections/2651/images/31363_a107618-00016?pId=125413) as follows:

a. Were the addresses on the settlement listed given in chronological order, or is the most recent one at the top?

b. The settlement seems to show they were found to belong to Penryn in Cornwall, so how come they were not returned there?

[jonwicken]

6. Elizabeth Moneypenny|Pasmore died in her early 70s in Poplar in 1847. Her death certificate states the cause of death was: Found dead at the foot of a flight of stairs apparently burnt to death by her clothes taking fire. There was an inquest on 13 September 1847 which I have found reported in the local newspaper. The coroner was W. Baker of 12 Chester Terrace, Regents Park.

Elizabeth Osborne Bastian|Osborne died in 1877 in her mid 60s in Bethnal Green of  Sudden Disease of Heart. There was an inquest by the Coroner for Middlesex on 28 December 1877.

My question is, might the coroners' reports for either death still survive?

[jonwicken]

7. John Pasmore senior was a Night Watchman for the East India Dock Company at the time of his wife's death in 1847 and his 1864 death certificate states he was a Pensioner Dock Constable.

Is anyone please familar with what records might survive for him in the East India Dock Company archive?

And if you got this far reading my numerous queries on the Pasmore family, thank you! If anyone can help with any of them, that would be amazing.

Thank you,
Jon

[wivenhoe]

Your reply #2

"...my 2 x great grandmother Elizabeth Johanna PASMORE after December 1837. Her siblings John William (b.1832, d. 1833), Elizabeth Catherine (b.1834), Mary (b.1835) and Eliza Ann (b. 1839, d. 1842) were all baptised, so was she not or have I missed it?"


Your reply #3

"... I cannot find the family of John PASMORE junior in the 1851 census. They would have been a family of at least 4 at this time: John born c1809, Elizabeth born c1814 and surviving children Mary born c1835 and Elizabeth Johanna born c1837."


The people to account for at Census 1851 should be parents John PASMAORE, wife Elizabeth, daughter Mary b. 1835, daughter Elizabeth Johanna b. 1837?


Ancestry London BDM

---------------------Marriage  10 Oct 1853 St Philip Bethnal Green  Tower Hamlets
PASSMORE Mary (X) ...spinster....18yrs....Severn St
Father...John PASSMORE....... dock worker

TAYLOR Richard Benjamin...bachelor ...21yrs...Severn Street
Father...Charles TAYLER....shoemaker

Witnesses   Charles TAYLER (X)    Mary Ann GASKIN (X)

----------------------Marriage 20 Jan 1856 St Philip Bethnal Green
PASMORE Elizabeth Johanna (X)......spinster..... 18y...12 Mary Ann Terrace
Father....John PASMORE labourer

ROBEY Robert....bachelor....19y....engineer....3 Hare St
Father...Robert ROBEY....labourer

Witnesses....John PASMORE...Mary TAYLOR (X)

Vic BDM



The Age 4 Oct 1897 p8
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/188145530?
ROBEY.-The friends of Robert ROBEY are respectfully invited to follow the remains
of his late dearly beloved wife, Elizabeth, to the place of interment,, the Melbourne General Cemetery. The funeral will leave 87 Courtney-Street North Melbourne, .TO-MORROW (Tuesday), 6th
 inst

The Age 15 May 1901 p12
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/190042040?
HILL.— The Friends, of the late Mr. JOHN HILL are respectfully invited 'to follow hls remains
to the  place of interment, the -Melbourne General Cemetery. The funeral will leave his residence. ,87 Courtney-street, North Melbourne, THIS DAY

The Age 14 May 1902 p1
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/199389570?
HILL— ......my dear husband beloved father of Ada K Hill, who departed
who departed this life at his late residence 87 Courtney-street, North Melbourne
....wife and daughter Minnie and Ada..

BDM VIC death
6461/1901   HILL  Jno   parents Cath TAYLOR / Wm  HILL
died  Melb E   age 52