Author Topic: KOYLI Service Number for Thomas Sweeney Wilson  (Read 162 times)

Offline Stirrick

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KOYLI Service Number for Thomas Sweeney Wilson
« on: Monday 14 June 21 10:03 BST (UK) »
I have a Thomas Sweeney Wilson who was KiA on 30 September 1918 while serving with the 2nd King's Own Yorkshire Light Infantry. His pension records show that he had previously served with the 10th Battalion.

Private Wilson's service number was 37266.
Does anyone have any idea when he would have enlisted ?

I've seen one or two posts that suggest that men had been transferred to the KOYLI from the Durham Light Infantry as raw recruits. Private Wilson was from Gateshead on Tyneside, so I wonder if this was the case with him ?

Offline jim1

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Re: KOYLI Service Number for Thomas Sweeney Wilson
« Reply #1 on: Monday 14 June 21 11:30 BST (UK) »
With the absence of a service record I'm afraid you'll never know if he was ever
in the DLI.
His first overseas Btn. was 10/KOYLI transferring to the 2nd. probably when the 10th.
was disbanded in Feb. 1918.
The 10th. went overseas in Sept. 1915 qualifying men for the 15 Star as your man didn't
receive this indicates an attestation date after that.
There is an online calculator where you can work out his attestation date however it's
a paid site:
https://www.wargratuity.uk/
I believe it can be worked out from his type 2 war gratuity of 9.00.
The calculation being 5 for year 1 + 10s. thereafter for every month.
This gives a service of 20 months up to his death = an attestation around the end of Feb. 1917.
(needs verifying).
You could look for service records for men with similar numbers & see if the move from
the DLI applied to them.
Warks:Ashford;Cadby;Clarke;Clifford;Cooke Copage;Easthope;
Edmonds;Felton;Colledge;Lutwyche;Mander(s);May;Poole;Withers.
Staffs.Edmonds;Addison;Duffield;Webb;Fisher;Archer
Salop:Easthope,Eddowes,Hoorde,Oteley,Vernon,Talbot,De Neville.
Notts.Clarke;Redfearne;Treece.
Som.May;Perriman;Cox
India Kane;Felton;Cadby
London.Haysom.
Lancs.Gay.
Worcs.Coley;Mander;Sawyer.
Kings of Wessex & Scotland
Census information is Crown copyright,from
www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/

Offline Stirrick

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Re: KOYLI Service Number for Thomas Sweeney Wilson
« Reply #2 on: Monday 14 June 21 12:18 BST (UK) »
Thanks Jim

The closest I had were 33050 (5 July 1916) and 34114 (12 Aug 1916).
Thomas wouldn't have been 18 until late 1916, so it looks like this fits.
However I didn't know if Service Numbers were simply assigned sequentially in the KOYLI.

I've also seen references to the lead '3' being a suffix for the 3rd (Reserve) Battalion.
So 3/7266 rather than 37236.
But, again, I'm not sure.

Andy


Offline jim1

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Re: KOYLI Service Number for Thomas Sweeney Wilson
« Reply #3 on: Monday 14 June 21 12:45 BST (UK) »
Generally numbers were sequential but not always.
I've not seen the 3 suffix as part of his service number where has this come from?
Warks:Ashford;Cadby;Clarke;Clifford;Cooke Copage;Easthope;
Edmonds;Felton;Colledge;Lutwyche;Mander(s);May;Poole;Withers.
Staffs.Edmonds;Addison;Duffield;Webb;Fisher;Archer
Salop:Easthope,Eddowes,Hoorde,Oteley,Vernon,Talbot,De Neville.
Notts.Clarke;Redfearne;Treece.
Som.May;Perriman;Cox
India Kane;Felton;Cadby
London.Haysom.
Lancs.Gay.
Worcs.Coley;Mander;Sawyer.
Kings of Wessex & Scotland
Census information is Crown copyright,from
www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/

Offline Stirrick

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Re: KOYLI Service Number for Thomas Sweeney Wilson
« Reply #4 on: Monday 14 June 21 18:23 BST (UK) »
Hi again, Jim

Looking again, I think this was my misunderstanding.

https://armyservicenumbers.blogspot.com/2017/12/3rd-special-reserve-battalion-kings-own.html

"The regimental number series continued to be used well into 1915. For instance, 3/3683 was issued on the 26th October 1915 and 3/3691 on the 20th November 1915. This is the highest number I have come across in this series although do beware other numbers masquerading as 3rd (Special Reserve) Battalion numbers."

So it looks like the 3/ suffix 'was' used, but not at the time Thomas would have joined the Regiment in late 1916.

I presume he would have gone to a Reserve Battalion first for his basic training.
So I thought that the 3/ suffix looked likely for a man being sent from the 3rd (Reserve) Bttn as a relacement to one of the Battalions already serving in France. In this case the 10th (Special) Bttn.

Or perhaps not. ;-)

A

Offline jim1

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Re: KOYLI Service Number for Thomas Sweeney Wilson
« Reply #5 on: Monday 14 June 21 21:14 BST (UK) »
If he doesn't have the 3 suffix he wasn't SR.
On attestation he would have been given his number
& sent to the training establishment usually the 3rd. Btn.
which also contained various types of Reservists who all had different numbers.
SR would have numbers of their own sequence.
Such are the vagaries of Army numbers.
Men got their own unique number which they had irrespective of movement between Regt's.
in 1920 up until then it was all a bit of a mess.
In June 1917 there was a dribble of reinforcements into 10/KOYLI amounting to about
15 men, he was probably one of those as training took 3 months.
The men you looked at that attested late 1915 most probably went in under the Derby Scheme.
This gave men a last chance opportunity to choose before conscription was introduced.
Warks:Ashford;Cadby;Clarke;Clifford;Cooke Copage;Easthope;
Edmonds;Felton;Colledge;Lutwyche;Mander(s);May;Poole;Withers.
Staffs.Edmonds;Addison;Duffield;Webb;Fisher;Archer
Salop:Easthope,Eddowes,Hoorde,Oteley,Vernon,Talbot,De Neville.
Notts.Clarke;Redfearne;Treece.
Som.May;Perriman;Cox
India Kane;Felton;Cadby
London.Haysom.
Lancs.Gay.
Worcs.Coley;Mander;Sawyer.
Kings of Wessex & Scotland
Census information is Crown copyright,from
www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/