Benjamin Wiliams, surgeon, apothecary, and corona Brecon, died 31 January 1832

[Llanfihangel]

Hi,

Benjamin Williams was well-known in Brecon, and was a strong supporter of Tredustan United Chapel in Talgarth. He was a son of Lewis Williams, Pentwyn, Gwenddwr, who was a "Non-conformist Squire" in that region (Ruth Bidgood).

He died in 1832, and was known as a Surgeon, Apothecary, and Coroner.

I found FindMyPast records of a Benjamin Williams baptised buried 5 May 1819, baptised 24 August 1819, possibly a son of John Williams and Eleanor Price Llandeilo'r Fan married 8 October 1819.

These records seem to be really odd, and probably don't refer to the same Benjamin Williams, but I am researching a Benjamin Williams born around that time and this is the only one I can find who lived in Brecon City.

Perhaps he was a child of Benjamin Williams surgeon, but there aren't any records of him getting married or having any children. While the Tredustan baptism records seem to be in order, the nonconformist chapel records of that time are still quite disorganised, so they may be missing.

Any help here would be appreciated. The Benjamin Williams in Radnor Ohio that I am researching was recorded as being born November 8 1818 in Wales, with parents who probably lived in Brecon.

Thanks again

Llanfi

[CaroleW]

He died in 1832, and was known as a Surgeon, Apothecary, and Coroner.

I found FindMyPast records of a Benjamin Williams baptised buried 5 May 1819, baptised 24 August 1819,

If Benjamin was an apothecary, surgeon & coroner & died 1832 - how could he have been b 1818.  That means he was 14 when he died?    Unless he was a child prodigy 

Your Benjamin would have been born mid - late 1700's

Your ref to FindMyPast records is confusing - baptised August 1819 but buried 3 months earlier in May 1819??

The Benjamin Williams in Radnor Ohio that I am researching was recorded as being born November 8 1818 in Wales

Radnor is not in Ohio??  If your Benjamin was b 1818 and died 1832 then he could not have had the occupations you list

[osprey]

Lewis Williams died in 1800 and left a lengthy will

http://www.rootschat.com/links/01qow/

He mentions wife Margaret, sons Philip, Benjamin & Lewis, daughters Abigail & Winifred. At the time of the will, Benjamin did not have a son.

The will of Lewis's father, also called Lewis from 1766 names the children of Lewis & Margaret at that time as Philip, Lewis, Benjamin, Sarah & Abigail, all under 21.

http://www.rootschat.com/links/01qox/

Possible marriage bond for the couple at NLW Lewis Williams, gent., Llandyfalle & Margaret Davies, spinster, Talachddu dated 28 May 1756.

Burial 3 Feb 1832 in Talachddu  Benjamin Williams 69 of Trosgoed & Brecon.
Death notice gives his age at 62 but that would mean he was born after his grandfather wrote his will.
https://newspapers.library.wales/view/3327655/3327658/17/

[osprey]

Will of Lewis Williams of Troscoed from 1847, mentions wife Elizabeth and daughter Helena Elizabeth married to John Holderness of Peckham

http://www.rootschat.com/links/01qoy/

Burial 25 May 1846 in Talachddu Lewis Williams 87 Trawsgoed

Will of eldest brother Philip, mentions wife Gwenllian, daughters Elizabeth & Margaretta
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01qoz/

burial 23 May 1837 in Talachddu Philip Williams 80 Argoed

I've only skimmed this last will as it's very long, but didn't notice any mention of children of Benjamin. Haven't found a will for Benjamin.

[Llanfihangel]

Hello CaroleW, Osprey, and all the kind people who reviewed this topic!
Thanks for your help!

Yes, the FindMyPast records I found for the Benjamin Williams baptised 1819 are very odd.. We have a child buried before he was baptised, and (possibly) both events occurred before the parents were married.

First of all, I made a mistake in my record of a Baptism of Benjamin at Llandeilo fan. It was John baptised by John and Eleanor Williams, not Benjamin.

The records of Benjamin's baptism and death are still in question.

The date of Benjamin Williams Baptism transcript seems to be wrong. On further inspection of the actual record on FindMyPast shows the Baptism took place between records on August and October 1819, so the actual date must be SEPTEMBER 24 1819. A comparison with another record on the same page shows that the parents were John and ANNE (not Elinor)

I checked the Burial record for Benjamin Williams 2 weeks old .. it was at the same Church and recorded by the same Vicar at St David's and it falls between other burial records on March and May 1819, so the actual date must be APRIL 5 1819.

I also did more research on Benjamin Williams surgeon and found a good account of his death and family, please see attached..

 I will follow up the illegible scrawl to see where John and Anne who baptised Benjamin on Sept 14 1819.

The Benjamin Williams I am looking for was born in Wales and died in Radnor Ohio.. see attached.

Please accept my humble apologies for the previous errors. An many thanks for your help!

Llanfi 

[osprey]

He died 3 April 1906 aged 88 years 4 months & 24 days which would put his date of birth in November 1817, but the year of birth given isn't 1817.

1841 census for Pentwyn has a Benjamin Williams enumerated as 25, so could be up to 29

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:M77F-T6V

This family would appear to that of John & Ann Williams. Register from Maesyberllan Baptist Church, Talachddu, 29 May 1837 recorded these births to the couple
William born in Troscoed, parish of Gwenddwr, 7 June 1818
Elizabeth born in Troscoed, parish of Gwenddwr, 19 May 1816
Benjamin born in Pwllcwrw, parish of Llandefalle, 7 August 1814
David born in Pwllcwrw, parish of Llandefalle, 14 Sept 1812
Margaret born in Brechfa Uchaf, parish of Llandefalle, 25 April 1807

John died in 1833 aged 58
https://newspapers.library.wales/view/3631250/3631254/49/

[Llanfihangel]

Hello all, and many thanks to Rootschat, Osprey, and CarolW in particular!

Bookbox managed to decipher the place name scribbled on the Baptism record. It is "Ffrawdrech" a huge mansion in St  David's Parish Brecon. The Tithe Maps of circa 1845 on line at the National Library of Wales show that it was owned by Samuel Church Esq. and occupied by David Powell. It was part of the Ffrawdrech Demesne Plantation, an enormous estate of hundreds of acres.
The estate had a more humble Lodge and it is possible that John Williams lived there. I make this comment because the Vicar would have been far more careful with the baptism entry, and might have put "Gent" or "Esq" next to John Williams name if he had been at all wealthy,

John Williams and Anne (Elinor) had another child, Edward, baptised at St David's in 1818. The name of his wife is a bit clearer on that record. It looks like Benjamin was baptised on 24 August 1819 (based on the order of months in the consecutive records (April 1, August, Aug 24. 29. and October 24 1819 in the baptism series)

While I can't find a record for John and Elinor's marriage, I will research the leads posted by Osprey.

Thank you all very much!

Llanfi 

[osprey]

is this the John & Eleanor you're looking for?

1841
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:M77N-325

1851
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:SGCN-HV7

Burial 16 March 1857 St John the Evangelist Brecon Eleanor Williams 66, wife of John Williams labourer, Watton
Possible marriage 2 Dec 1814 in Merthyr Cynog for John Williams & Elinor Price.