Author Topic: Information on Annie Sinclair m. James Mitchell lived in Kilwinning  (Read 718 times)

Offline AussieScotfindingfamily

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Information on Annie Sinclair m. James Mitchell lived in Kilwinning
« on: Tuesday 20 July 21 05:37 BST (UK) »
Hi Everyone. It's my first time posting here and I am trying to learn more about my Grandfather's family.
I know his mother's name was Annie McNab nee Dillon, and she married his Father John Sinclair in abt 1930. After John's passing in 1936, she married a man named James Mitchell in 1941. They lived in Montgomerie Terrace, Kilwinning. She passed away at this address in 1942. Annie and James' marriage entry shows her as an Explosives worker. I am guessing at a Munitions factory somewhere in Glasgow.
My Grandfather told me she had a daughter to James, and my Grandfather always called this girl 'Betty'. Having looked up records through Scotlandspeople, I can only find an Elizabeth Mitchell born in Ayr in 1941.
After Annie's passing, I believe her mother Jane McElroy took Annie's children in with her, at Plantation/Govan.

Does anyone have any information that could help me find out where Annie worked, What Annie and James' daughter's name is and what became of her (why James didn't care for her after Annie's passing). Any information would be a massive help.

Thank you so much!!!

Offline Forfarian

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Re: Information on Annie Sinclair m. James Mitchell lived in Kilwinning
« Reply #1 on: Tuesday 20 July 21 10:42 BST (UK) »
Annie and James' marriage entry shows her as an Explosives worker. I am guessing at a Munitions factory somewhere in Glasgow.
Unlikely to be in Glasgow.

They tended not to put munitions factories in densely populated areas, either because of the risk to life if there was an explosion, or (later on) because munitions factories would be prime targets for enemy bombing raids.

I imagine that the one she worked in would have been the Nobel one at Ardeer, which is closer to Kilwinning. See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ardeer,_North_Ayrshire

You can view the marriage of Annie McNab Dillon to John Ratcliffe Sinclair at www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk. This will tell you the names of her parents.

It looks as if McNab was Annie's middle name. There is no record in Scotland of a marriage of an Ann* Dillon to a Mr McNab, and in Scotland it is not the practice to use a maiden surname as a middle name after marriage.

An Annie McNab Dillon was born in Irvine in 1912. You can also view her birth certificate at Scotland's People. This will tell you when and where her parents were married. (But see below)

Interestingly, her death is indexed as Annie McElroy or Sinclair or Mitchell. Not as Dillon or as McNab. This raises the possibility that she was born illegitimate.
Never trust anything you find online (especially submitted trees and transcriptions on Ancestry, MyHeritage, FindMyPast and other commercial web sites) unless it's an image of an original document - and even then be wary because errors can and do occur.

Offline ColC

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Re: Information on Annie Sinclair m. James Mitchell lived in Kilwinning
« Reply #2 on: Tuesday 20 July 21 11:15 BST (UK) »
Interestingly, her death is indexed as Annie McElroy or Sinclair or Mitchell. Not as Dillon or as McNab. This raises the possibility that she was born illegitimate.
[/quote]

There are two marriage entries in Glasgow.

JOHN RATCLIFFE SINCLAIR   Marriage    DILLON   ANNIE MCNAB   1930   Plantation
JOHN RATCLIFFE SINCLAIR   Marriage    MCELROY   ANNIE MCNAB   1930   Plantation

Many people who worked at Ardeer (Link as posted) lived in the Kilwinning area, including my late mother in law.

Colin
Clarke, Trickett, Orton, Lawless, Norton, Detheridge, Kirby, Goodfellow, Wagstaff, Lowe, etc.


Offline Forfarian

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Re: Information on Annie Sinclair m. James Mitchell lived in Kilwinning
« Reply #3 on: Tuesday 20 July 21 12:23 BST (UK) »
There are two marriage entries in Glasgow.
JOHN RATCLIFFE SINCLAIR   Marriage    DILLON   ANNIE MCNAB   1930   Plantation
JOHN RATCLIFFE SINCLAIR   Marriage    MCELROY   ANNIE MCNAB   1930   Plantation
Those are not two marriage entries. They are two index entries for one marriage. Both have the same reference No 271.

The marriage of an illegitimate person was supposed to be indexed under both the person's surnames (father's and mother's), but in practice this didn't always happen because people didn't want to admit to being illegitimate. In this case it appears to have been done by the book.

Never trust anything you find online (especially submitted trees and transcriptions on Ancestry, MyHeritage, FindMyPast and other commercial web sites) unless it's an image of an original document - and even then be wary because errors can and do occur.

Offline CraigM63

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Re: Information on Annie Sinclair m. James Mitchell lived in Kilwinning
« Reply #4 on: Tuesday 20 July 21 22:11 BST (UK) »
There is this marriage in Irvine in 1912, which suggests that the McElroy comes from the man that her mother subsequently married.

DILLON    JANET      MCELROY   THOMAS   1912   595/ 19   Irvine

A check of Annie's birth registration would show whether there was an RCE naming her father, there doesn't seem to be a related Sheriff's Court paternity decree.

Offline CraigM63

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Re: Information on Annie Sinclair m. James Mitchell lived in Kilwinning
« Reply #5 on: Tuesday 20 July 21 22:23 BST (UK) »
There are also no obvious Mitchell deaths, mother's maiden name Dillon or McElroy, on ScotlandsPeople, that fall within the right time frame so it's possible if there was a daughter of this second marriage that she is still living. There is a Sinclair death, mother's maiden name Dillon, in 1986 with an implied birth year of 1934/35 that looks to be a child of her first marriage.

Offline AussieScotfindingfamily

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Re: Information on Annie Sinclair m. James Mitchell lived in Kilwinning
« Reply #6 on: Tuesday 20 July 21 23:58 BST (UK) »
Thanks you all for your replies!

I do actually have all of that information through ScotlandsPeople. I have copies of Annie's marriage to both John and James, I have Annie's birth certificate etc. I also have her son Thomas's death certificate. (I ordered it because I wanted to help find my Grandfather's brother for him; and sadly had to tell him his brother passed away in 1986, as I also had to tell him his elder half brother John passed away in 2014). I have as yet been unable to track down his younger half sister 'Betty', but remember my Grandfather telling me when their mother passed away from TB when he was 10, they went to live with his Grandmother (Annie's mother) in Plantation. 'Betty' was 1 year old at the most. He told me when he went to National Service, he used to send the bulk of his wage back to his Grandmother to help with raising Thomas and Betty.

I am unsure how to track down whatever happened to Betty after Jane McElroy, their Grandmother raising them, passed away. Betty would have been approx. 16.

I have ordered James Mitchell's Death Certificate also.

I guess I was more hoping that maybe someone might have known someone who knew Annie and James, and consequently their infant daughter 'Betty'.
Unfortunately my Grandfather has just passed away so I'll never be able to tell him what happened to his sister, but I'd love to know

Thank you all

Offline loobylooayr

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Re: Information on Annie Sinclair m. James Mitchell lived in Kilwinning
« Reply #7 on: Wednesday 21 July 21 22:22 BST (UK) »
Hi AussieScot,

My goodness, poor Annie McElroy/Sinclair marries James Mitchell in 1941 , gives birth to a daughter in 1941 and dies in 1942.
Do you know the date of the second marriage? And the date of Annie's death, please? Did she die at home or in a TB sanatorium/hospital?
Is it possible her baby daughter was born before the second marriage?
I note you have mentioned finding a birth of a girl with the correct name in Ayr in 1941 - it would be unusual at this time for the baby to be born and registered in Ayr when the couple were living in Kilwinning some 18 miles away. Most babies were still home births but there was a maternity hospital called Buckreddan House at Kilwinning.

I haven't used your grandfather's sister's name as I am conscious she could still be alive and Rootschat does not allow us to post details on living people.
 Wishing you success,

Looby :)

Offline AussieScotfindingfamily

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Re: Information on Annie Sinclair m. James Mitchell lived in Kilwinning
« Reply #8 on: Thursday 22 July 21 00:06 BST (UK) »
Good morning Looby,

Thank you for your information, I appreciate it and it gives me a guide on what to look into.

Annie and James married on 11th June 1941, at the Congregational Church Manse, Kilwinning.
Annie lived at Montgomerie Terrace prior to the wedding, and it seems James moved to this address after their wedding, because Annie's death registration has her passing away on Christmas Day in 1942, at this same address with James present.
Their marriage registration lists Annie at the time of the marriage as an Explosives worker, and I have read that there were Munitions factories at that time especially around Clydebank? That's the only reason I thought she may have worked at a munitions factory, being WWII at the time.

My Grandfather was always quite adamant his sister was born in 1941 and believes his sister definitely went by her father's surname.

This is the only information I have so far sadly.

Thank you again for your reply and information. I will try my hardest to narrow down baby Mitchell's birthplace.

Kind regards
AussieScot