John Daniels m. 20 Oct 1861

[baileyscusa]

Hi Everyone,
After a month or so of trawling through Census information trying to find my 2nd great grandfather prior to his marriage to my 2nd great grandmother, Susan Prole, I have recognized that I'm not going to get any further without some help.

I have been able to follow the Prole line back to the 1841 Census but no such luck on the Daniels line. I have also found the family of John and Susan Daniels on the 1871, 1881 and 1891 Censuses. But John Daniels prior to 1861 has eluded me. So here's what's on the marriage document.

20 Oct 1861 - Trinity Church in the parish of St Mary Newington, Surrey
John Daniels - Full age - Bachelor - Boiler Maker - add. Wellington Street
Susan Prole - Minor - Spinster - add. the same
Fathers - William Daniels - Smith / John Prole - Leather Dresser

And here they are in the 1871 Census.
London - St Mary Magdalen Bermondsey - Leather Market - 11
Address - 13 Brook Street
John Daniels - Head - Mar - 30 - occ. Boiler Maker - b. Surrey, Southwark
Susan Daniels - Wife - Mar - 26 - occ. na - b. Surrey, Southwark
John Daniels - Son - 7 - occ. Scholar - b. Surrey, Lambeth
William Daniels - Son - 5 - occ. Scholar - b. Surrey, Southwark
Susan Daniels - Dau - 3 - occ. Scholar - b. Surrey, St Georges
Alfred Daniels - Son - 7mo. - b. Surrey, St Georges (my great grandfather)

So if anyone can help me find John Daniels in the 1861, 1851 or 1841 Censuses I would really appreciate it.

Thanks!

[amondg]

1851 census the Prole family is at 51 Wellington Street, so they gave her address when they married.

I was looking at the names of the children, eldest son John named for him or her father, William named for his father, Susan named for his wife. Susan Prole had a sister Jane, so that leaves Alfred, Benjamin and George for his side of the family.
Not much help at the moment. 

[Neale1961]

There is a birth registration for a John Daniels in 1840 Southwark; Mmn JONES

[rosie99]

There is a birth registration for a John Daniels in 1840 Southwark; Mmn JONES

His parents were Daniel Daniels and Eleanor Jones
Daniel Daniels
Eleanor Jones
Marriage  02 Mar 1828
Newington, St Mary

Daniel was a Brew House servant in 1851

[baileyscusa]

Thanks for the replies. The Daniel Daniels / Ellen(Eleanor) Jones connection has been pretty much the only one that FindMyPast and Ancestry have been able to suggest. There just don't seem to be any William Daniels connections in the Southwark area that fit.

There are actually 2 different Daniel Daniels in Southwark area in 1861.
Surrey - Southwark St George - Borough Road - District 2
Address - 3 Mitre Court
Daniel Daniels - Head - Mar - 60 - occ. Brewers Labourer - b. Camarthanshire, Wales
Eliza Daniels - Wife - Mar - 59 - b. Soho, Middlesex
John Daniels - Son - Unm - 21 - occ. Dock Labourer - b. Surrey, St Georges
Mary Daniels - Dau - Unm - 15 - occ. Hat Trimmer - b. Surrey, St Georges
Samuel Daniels - Dau - 4 - occ. Scholar - b. Surrey, St Saviour
Esther Daniels - Dau - 1 - b. Surrey, St Georges

Surrey - Southwark St George - Borough Road - District 5
Daniel Daniels - Head - Mar - 29 - occ. Brewers Servant - b. Surrey, Southwark
Sarah Daniels - Wife - Mar - 26 - b. Middlesex, Bethnal Green
Mary Ann Daniels - Dau - 6 - occ. Scholar - b. Surrey, Southwark
Charles Daniels - Son - 3 - b. Surrey, Southwark
Eleanor Daniels - Dau - 1 - b. Surrey, Southwark

But unfortunately based on the Marriage certificate of John Daniels, the father/occupation just don't fit. Wish I had a few more clues.

Again thanks for the replies!

[rosie99]

Have you discounted the single John Daniels occ Boiler Maker age 21 who is Lodging in Faversham in 1861 census.  RG09/526 Folio 31 Page 2

I realise that his place of birth does not match (Bristol) but census are not always reliable

[jomcd967]

Hi Rosie,

I was also looking at John born in Bristol…
1861 - a lodger in Faversham as per Rosie

1891 - 75 Heath Road Clapham
John Daniels, 50, Boiler smith, born Bristol
Emma Daniels, 48, wife, born Kent
Joseph W Daniels, 18, son, apprentice, born London
Harriet M Daniels, 15, dau, born London
John Daniels, 13, son, born London
Thomas Daniels, 9, son, born London
Albert E Daniels, 7, son, born London

1901 same address
John Daniels, 60, boiler smith (railway) b. Bristol
Emma “, 58, b. Chiselhurst
Albert E “, 17, b. Battersea

1911 same address
John Daniels, 71, wid, boiler maker, b. Bristol
Albert Edward “, 27, engine fitter, b. Battersea
Florence Beatrice “, 26
John Albert, 4
Florence Emma 4
Emily Beatrice, 10 mths

Did he leave Susan and start a new family with Emma?

Jo   

[jomcd967]

Joseph William, Harriet Maria and Albert Edward all registered with MMN as Bubb (I haven’t checked the others)

[jomcd967]

It can’t be the same person as he is with wife Emma in 1881?

Edited to add John Daniels married Emma Bubb, 1861 in Dover.

Back to the drawing board….