Author Topic: Mills located near Kirkconnel 1800s  (Read 1577 times)

Offline janebell

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Re: Mills located near Kirkconnel 1800s
« Reply #27 on: Friday 27 August 21 15:00 BST (UK) »
Martha Henderson, and Peter Rutherford were married at St. Cuthbert's, Midlothian, Scotland, May 3 1833, parish 834.

Offline Forfarian

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Re: Mills located near Kirkconnel 1800s
« Reply #28 on: Friday 27 August 21 17:58 BST (UK) »
Yes, that is what the marriage record says.

It also says that Martha's father was Thomas Henderson, wright in Edinburgh. Not John Henderson, miller at Kirkconnel.

So why do you think he was John Henderson in Kirkconnel?
Never trust anything you find online (especially submitted trees and transcriptions on Ancestry, MyHeritage, FindMyPast and other commercial web sites) unless it's an image of an original document - and even then be wary because errors can and do occur.

Offline janebell

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Re: Mills located near Kirkconnel 1800s
« Reply #29 on: Saturday 28 August 21 02:29 BST (UK) »
The Martha Henderson I have located was born Feb. 12 1815 in Kirkconnel, Dumfriesshire, Scotland. Mother was Marion McKenderick, father was John Henderson. She married Peter Rutherford, so this confirms that I have located the correct birth record for her. Her parents are listed with the marriage record in Midlothian, Scotland, 1833 to Peter Rutherford.


Offline Forfarian

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Re: Mills located near Kirkconnel 1800s
« Reply #30 on: Saturday 28 August 21 10:05 BST (UK) »
The Martha Henderson I have located was born Feb. 12 1815 in Kirkconnel, Dumfriesshire, Scotland. Mother was Marion McKenderick, father was John Henderson. She married Peter Rutherford, so this confirms that I have located the correct birth record for her. Her parents are listed with the marriage record in Midlothian, Scotland, 1833 to Peter Rutherford.
DonM's reply #5 above is an image of the original marriage record. It says, "Peter Rutherford, Mason, Residing in Dean Path Water of Leith, and Martha Henderson, Residing in No 57 Nicolson Street, Daughter of Thomas Henderson, Wright in Edinburgh, both in this parish, have been three times proclaimed in order to marriage and no objections offered. Married on the Third day of May thereafter by the Reverend William Innes, Minister of the Baptist congregation in Elder Street".

Why do you think that that original record from 1833 is wrong, and where did you find a marriage record naming Martha's parents as John Henderson and Marion McKenderick?

Never trust anything you find online (especially submitted trees and transcriptions on Ancestry, MyHeritage, FindMyPast and other commercial web sites) unless it's an image of an original document - and even then be wary because errors can and do occur.

Offline Forfarian

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Re: Mills located near Kirkconnel 1800s
« Reply #31 on: Saturday 28 August 21 13:47 BST (UK) »
Further evidence that the daughter of John Henderson and Marion McKendrick was not the Martha Henderson who married Peter Rutherford.

ColC has already posted part of the 1841 census in the village of Kirkconnel.
John Henderson, coal m(iner), 70
Marion Henderson, 64
Martha Henderson, 25
Margaret Henderson, 21
John Stevenson, 3
William Stevenson, 1
all born in Dumfries-shire

Loobylooayr found the marriage of Martha Henderson and Thomas Stevenson in Kirkconnel on 18 October 1839.

There is a baptism of William Stevenson, son of Thomas Stevenson and Martha Henderson, in Kirkconnel on 12 April 1840. John would have been born before Martha and Thomas were married, which would account for the absence of a baptism record.

And Martha and William are still there in 1851
Martha Henderson, widow, 35, born Kirkconnel
William Stevenson, son, 11, born Kirkconnel

Note that it is perfectly normal to find widows, and indeed married women, listed by their maiden surnames in the early census. It does not imply that they are unmarried.

By 1861 they have moved to Muirkirk, Ayrshire
Martha Stevenson, widow, 46, born Kirkconnel
William Stevenson, son, 21, born Kirkconnel
John Henderson Stevenson, son, 10, born Kirkconnel

There is a birth record in Kirkconnel of John Henderson, illegitimate son of Charles McLoud, railway labourer, and Martha Henderson, on 16 April 1851.

In Muirkirk in 1871
Martha Stevenson, widow, 54, born Kirkconnel
John Stevenson, son, 20, born Kirkconnel

Can't find any of them after that - they may have emigrated. But unless there were two John Hendersons, married to two Marions, both of whom had a daughter Martha in Kirkconnel in 1814/1816, this Martha must be the daughter of John Henderson and Marion McKenderick of Kirkconnel.

Never trust anything you find online (especially submitted trees and transcriptions on Ancestry, MyHeritage, FindMyPast and other commercial web sites) unless it's an image of an original document - and even then be wary because errors can and do occur.

Offline MonicaL

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Re: Mills located near Kirkconnel 1800s
« Reply #32 on: Saturday 28 August 21 15:53 BST (UK) »
The Burials

Peter
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HT-DRKS-HNJ?i=118&cc=1627831&personaUrl=%2Fark%3A%2F61903%2F1%3A1%3AKH64-8CD

Martha
https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/78549847/martha-rutherford
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:KH64-LYK

Don

The other factor that needs to also be considered is Martha and Peter's ages at death. From this info, it gives an indication on approximate birth years for both. In addition, Martha's gravestone inscription was even more precise in respect of her age, including number of months.

Useful details, Don. So, from these burials, we have approximate birth years of:

Peter 1793 - died aged 53 in 1846

Martha 1807 - died aged 37 in 1844


Monica
Census information Crown Copyright, www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline Forfarian

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Re: Mills located near Kirkconnel 1800s
« Reply #33 on: Saturday 28 August 21 16:49 BST (UK) »
I expect the problem arises because the baptism record of the correct Martha is not readily (or at all) available. Scotland's People does not hold the baptism registers of the Baptist Church. Therefore none of the web sites that offer indexes and transcription of the records on Scotland's People will have them either.

Someone will have found that 1833 marriage and, unaware of Martha Henderson or Rutherford's age at death, has assumed, incorrectly, that she must be the daughter of John H and Marion McK and has put that into an online tree. No doubt other people have copied that, complete with error.

(I see that FamilySearch indexes the marriage, including her father Thomas, but has assumed that she was 20 when she married, and therefore that she was born about 1813. This is wildly unreliable.)

janebell has then found this piece of wrong information and believes it to be correct, in spite of the evidence of the original marriage record, the marriage, baptisms and census in Kirkconnel, and the date of death.

If janebell can show me evidence, in the form of an original marriage record (not an index, or a transcription, or an extract from an online tree or printed book or other secondary source, let alone from an online tree), saying that Martha's parents were John H and Marion McK, I will film myself eating my hat and post the film on Youtube with a link from this thread.
Never trust anything you find online (especially submitted trees and transcriptions on Ancestry, MyHeritage, FindMyPast and other commercial web sites) unless it's an image of an original document - and even then be wary because errors can and do occur.

Offline DonM

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Re: Mills located near Kirkconnel 1800s
« Reply #34 on: Saturday 28 August 21 18:12 BST (UK) »
You eating a hat?  Now that would be funny.

Don

Offline DonM

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Re: Mills located near Kirkconnel 1800s
« Reply #35 on: Saturday 28 August 21 18:23 BST (UK) »
It must be true...

https://www.ancestry.ca/family-tree/tree/74634498/family/familyview?cfpid=46339351594

There, you don't have to eat a hat, unless you want to.

Don