Author Topic: Charles henry briggs.  (Read 3066 times)

Offline judb

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Re: Charles henry briggs.
« Reply #99 on: Tuesday 21 September 21 11:21 BST (UK) »
Trove has quite a few mentions of W Chatfield in Goulburn around 1855-60.  I won't enumerate them but the mentions include:
22 December 1859 - Alderman Chatfield present at a Goulburn Municipal Council meeting
November 1859 - W Chatfield as a director, the local Building Society

https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/118248634 - 8 October 1859
MARRIED
By- W. Chatfield, Esq., district registrar, on 6th inst., JANE EVANS, lately from London, to JAMES SWAIN, widower, of Goulburn.

So it seems Chatfield is a civil alderman and registrar rather than being in Holy Orders.

Judith
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"Time present and time past are both perhaps present in time future..." T S Eliot

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Offline majm

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Re: Charles henry briggs.
« Reply #100 on: Tuesday 21 September 21 11:29 BST (UK) »
Official transcriptions record what is on the official record.   NSW BDM official records for marriages in that era IF they have been reconciled note that action in the margin, as I described earlier in this thread and attached a snip.   
Official transcribers as part of their responsibilities note that margin endorsement on their transcription.   

I find it hard to understand how any clergyman had any authoriity to conduct a civil marriage ceremony in the Registrars office in 1859.   

In NSW in that era the clergy conducted marriage ceremonies in accordance with the rites of the denomination that ordained them, and which naturally reflected the form of the 1855 NSW marriage Acts.  The ceremony was in two concurrent parts, mostly religious. 

When it came the moment for signing,  the church registers included all the details, and the civil register was basically just a summary, sometimes scant family history noted, often no ages, no birth places, no parents details etc.  That summary info often  was all that the NSW BDM had on the marriages 1856-1895  until the  NDWBDM commenced to reconcile their own records with the church records.   

From 1856,  the statute law allowed civil ceremonies (ceremonies without a religious form) to be conducted by Civil  officers appointed by the Registrar General. 

Thanks Judith for chasing W Chatfield.  On a quick phone hook up with my retired rellies, no sighting by that name as a Minister of Religion.  Likely a Registry Office marriage.  :)


JM.
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Offline majm

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Re: Charles henry briggs.
« Reply #101 on: Tuesday 21 September 21 11:44 BST (UK) »
A Sydney baptism    :D

Ann, a daughter of John and Sarah SMITH, residing at Hyde Park, Sydney.  He is recorded as a Private in the Royal Veteran Corps by Rev Richard Hill, St James C of E, Sydney.  That Ann's date of birth is 13 March 1830 and the date of her baptism is 9 May 1830.

   
JM

This chap is a pensioner soldier.   :) 

JM
The information in my posts is provided for academic and non-commercial research purposes. 
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Offline Sandiehawk

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Re: Charles henry briggs.
« Reply #102 on: Tuesday 21 September 21 12:04 BST (UK) »
Majm, I wasn't inferring that W Chatfield was a minister of religion. Just posting the words written on the transcription.
On the left side under Place of Marriage and Religion is the word  Minister.  On the right are the relevant details for each question.
There is nothing else on the transcription.

Offline sparrett

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Re: Charles henry briggs.
« Reply #103 on: Tuesday 21 September 21 12:24 BST (UK) »
Did we ever find the birth index for son John (BRIGGS) born after the death of William BRIGGS in 1858? At the asylum ages 5 ish years in 1865?

A straw to clutch at---- ;D

BRIAN John J
7178/1860
Father JOHN
Mother ANN
At GOULBURN


Sue

MMmmm..

I think I would be giving this due consideration as a birth for John ( later known as  BRIGGS)
I cannot yet see a death for BRYANT in the right time frame, though Ann/Hannah is destitute and unable to care for her children by 1863.

Sue
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Offline majm

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Re: Charles henry briggs.
« Reply #104 on: Tuesday 21 September 21 12:41 BST (UK) »
Agree Sue,  that birth index now fits, and add, and she may have moved to Sydney if deserted, looking for her Mr Bryant...  :-\ 

The ancient rellies are "on the case"  :D  and chucklng over the construct of a District Registrar being recorded as a Minister ... apparently someone at the Reg Gens Office in Sydney in 1860 should have struck through the word 'Minister'  ...  You see, those ancient rellies  include retired C of E clergy ie licenced to conduct marriages  and retired NSW senior officers i.e. licenced to conduct marriages.

 ;D ;D ;D

JM
The information in my posts is provided for academic and non-commercial research purposes. 
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Offline majm

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Re: Charles henry briggs.
« Reply #105 on: Wednesday 22 September 21 03:32 BST (UK) »
 :D  :D

A baptism – could this be an older brother for Ann?  Notice the occupation for baby’s dad…


John William, son of John SMITH a Private in the Royal Veteran Corps, and his wife Sarah SMITH, abode : Castlereagh St (Sydney), John William born 1 March 1828, baptised 30 March 1828 by Rev Richard HILL,  St James C of E, Sydney.   

https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XTCT-4ZR

Australian Joint Copy Project has digitised the paylists for The Royal Veteran Corps, free to search via Trove.  Reel 3917 could be helpful. 



JM
The information in my posts is provided for academic and non-commercial research purposes. 
Random Acts of Kindness Given Freely are never Worthless for they are Priceless.
Qui scit et non docet.    Qui docet et non vivit.    Qui nescit et non interrogat.   
All Census Look Ups Are Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
I do not have a face book or a twitter account.

Offline Sandiehawk

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Re: Charles henry briggs.
« Reply #106 on: Wednesday 22 September 21 04:15 BST (UK) »
I have also found a possible brother for John William.
William Charles  1833-1902.
Mother Sarah.
Father John,  farmer.
Weren't men from the Veteran's Corps granted land at retirement?

Offline sparrett

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Re: Charles henry briggs.
« Reply #107 on: Wednesday 22 September 21 04:20 BST (UK) »
Bad news for the group of brickmakers at Towrang as floods in Feb 1860 come through.
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/103400968

Perhaps enough to dishearten a 22 year old husband.(Brickmaker of Towrang)

Sue

PS ADDING a question.
Was there not an institution of some sort for the destitute or needy closer to Goulburn than Sydney?

ADDING again.
Unless maybe John and Ann BRYANT both went together to Sydney, where John had been born< and that is where he died??

BRYANT John
604/1861
Father WIilliam
Mother Elizabeth
SYDNEY
 
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